A couple of sincere questions.

alvin l nunley

Premium User
toe; in/out. When someone says, 1/8 toe in/out, are they talking the difference between the 2 front tires, or just the distance between the front of 2 front tires?

Which tire is doing the driving down the straight. Which tire is spinning. It would be nice if somebody could do some kind of an experiment to determine the answer to that question. Spinning, I guess, would make the tire hotter. Which one gets the hottest? LR or RR?
 

gcashwell

Member
Toe in/out is the deviation from straight ahead.

Both rear tires are driving the kart down the straight, because they are joined by the solid rear axle. However, the kart will try to turn itself left due to banking and stagger.

the LR and RR could each be the hotter tire given different track and/or handling conditions. Most of your heat is generated during cornering.

I highly recommend Tod Godwin’s books and Mike McCarthy’s book for a full explanation.
 
Al, toe determines the placement of the front tires from straight ahead, to answer the question, its the distance at the front of the front tires.
The rear tires are connected by a solid axle, yes, but if only going in a straight line (Which we arent but for sake of arguement) , the LR would be the tire driving, reason it has so much more weight on that tire verses the RR. The experiment you say would be nice, been done long ago with research and development through the kart manufacturers.
As for which can get hotter, could be either tire, we use straights and cornering. Depends on amount of grip track has, track temp, ambient temp, properly prepped tires, properly prepped kart. Lots of variables there.
Now all of the info here is with dirt tracks and LTO karts.
 

alvin l nunley

Premium User
I really appreciate all the responses, but I was hoping for some hard data on the rear axle questions.
"If the data can't support the theory, get a new theory". (Al Nunley)
 

95 shaw

Premium User
Lmao

I predicted several years ago,
Any response which did not agree with your "theory " would be met with negative response.
I see the theory being, if I don't admit I am wrong, I cannot be wrong.
No data accepted unless matches theory.
 

95 shaw

Premium User
Just an fyi.
Way more info has been given to deny you theory than you have ever offered in support of your theory.

Please enlighten the rest of us. Obviously, you have hard data to support your conclusions.

Honestly, you have hurt way more than you have helped, in this aspect.
 
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alvin l nunley

Premium User
Thank you for the toe-in information, I appreciate it. But'sI don't appreciate someone suggesting that I must be stupid. I know what toe-in is, I was only inquiring what everybody else's interpretation is. Like everybody's use of the word "Billet", I was afraid my interpretation was not current.
 

Bob Evans

Grumpy Old Admin
Staff member
The first one is easy, Al.
toe.jpg


The second would depend on the coefficient of friction on each of the rear tires. I suppose that, if equal on each tire, both tires could be slipping.
Or maybe both always slip, as a percentage of their individual coefficient of friction.
 

tecbigdog

Premium User
Lets see. I think that I will ask a question, that I already know the answer to, just to see if everyone else thinks they know what the answer is.

Now, why would I do that?

Al, don't push that 'Stupid' theory, you may get an answer to that also.
 

Chipg56

Member
Lets see. I think that I will ask a question, that I already know the answer to, just to see if everyone else thinks they know what the answer is.

Now, why would I do that?

Al, don't push that 'Stupid' theory, you may get an answer to that also.
I'll answer that, Al is definitely NOT stupid.
 

OVALTECH1

Premium User
Thank you for the toe-in information, I appreciate it. But'sI don't appreciate someone suggesting that I must be stupid. I know what toe-in is, I was only inquiring what everybody else's interpretation is. Like everybody's use of the word "Billet", I was afraid my interpretation was not current.
Are you referring to the “block of wood” or the “quarters in which troops lodge” when you say “BILLET”. 🤔
 

OVALTECH1

Premium User
I hear you tho Al... everything made out of aluminum these days is “billet” aluminum. When it’s either a machined extrusion or an investment cast that’s been worked.
 

OVALTECH1

Premium User
Al, I worked tool and die up until I baled and got into welding and fabricating so I’m on board with ya .... I’ve seen some billets in my time here.
 

Skidude

Member
toe; in/out. When someone says, 1/8 toe in/out, are they talking the difference between the 2 front tires, or just the distance between the front of 2 front tires?

Which tire is doing the driving down the straight. Which tire is spinning. It would be nice if somebody could do some kind of an experiment to determine the answer to that question. Spinning, I guess, would make the tire hotter. Which one gets the hottest? LR or RR?
Toe in/toe out:
With both front wheels square with the rear wheels and the steering wheel straight, that is neutral toe, or 0. Now, measuring from the front either of the front wheels, you can toe either side in or out. If you move the right side toe out 1/4” and the left side toe in 1/4” you are running 0 total to but not neutral, you’ve just moved your steering wheel out of location. If you toe the left side out 1/8” and the right side in 1/4” you are running 1/8” total toe in with steering out of location. If you toe both in 1/8” you have 1/4” toe in. Toe in brings the front of the wheel toward the center, out just the opposite.

Can’t answer your other question.
 
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