---ARL--- (Affordable Racing League)

People (in-general) without realizing it, just do not understand the 'principle meaning' in/for a 'Claimer Rule'! The whole idea of the rule is to Not allow too much time, effort or money in 'besting' others for the sake-of-Winning just because one can!
 
do what Hanging Rock Kartway did and go predator motor with governors in working order with a claim, i also think Sickle Hill also does the same thing with a good turn out
 
here's my take....start with a predator. get the part numbers for three cams...all with the .224 lift...same with the header and a no touch rule on the head. start with it as a basic motor with one of these cams and one of these headers and you have to use stock valve train, but you get the springs thru the track. stock rockers only, no 1.2 or 1.3. get a stock motor and get the numbers and don't vary this at all. give an inch and everyone will take a mile. check the top three EVERY WEEK plus one or two others. throw the winner out if it's even a microbe out of stock specs. don't seal the motors, but make sure everyone knows that you have to use only these stock numbers from these companies....if the numbers have been touched or altered where you can't read them...throw them out. do this one or two times and pretty soon you will have a class that knows not to monkey with things. but you CAN NOT allow even the smallest infraction or it's a all a waste of effort.....you may have a small variance between the motors, but on the stock parts this would be acceptable. But!!!! if you say that you can run XYZ cam and it comes in without the numbers visible or they look to be scratched or oterhwsie nto readable....throw the driver out. headers are easy to look at and see if they are right, cams have a number engraved and you can tell which ones have messed with and the ones that haven't....you could even go so far as to get the cmas and headers and springs and sell them at the track...this way you know.... and do this with the claim rule........
Well then i will weld on my stock cam, get the lift right and add more duration, I will also twist the cam to get the best performance.
I will buy 10 engines and hand pick the best parts
Same story different engine, we bought pallets of the clones when they were raced this way and hand picked parts, trust me it was more $$$$ than what a BSP cost now
 
Ya know it's not hard to take a kart engine on and off.
If Dallas Mini wants equal engines than Dallas Mini could buy 10 or so sealed engines and "rent" them to those that show up and take them back at the end of the nights festivities. Spec tire with a duro rule, gear rule(help protect the engine) and weight classes.
 
I know this is not easy to get somthing like this Rollin. I have read a lot of good idea's and many things that could work...I don't think the lo206 is for the racers at DMS... We will be trying to focus on the predator motor and develope a rule base of standards. I do like the rental engine concept... its the cost to DMS up front that would be tuff to handle...But there no doubt about keepin it fair...thanks to all for your help and comments. ..please keep it coming just the fact of the views and replies let us know ---ARL--- CAN WORK!!!!
 
I think that your on the right track, but again, it's getting people to accept that monkeying with what your trying to do isn't going to fly. and in regards to the twisting a cam or rewelding it and the hand picking parts....your right, and I admit that I would look for any advantage too. but this is also going against the "spirit and intent" of the rules. there has to be a compromise along the lines that will not stifle the racers, but at the same time, keep the competition close. when dealing with the cams and twisting them or rewelding them, simple measurements of the basic cam as it comes from the maker will yield numbers that can't be changed. hand picking the parts....well, you're right....I would look at the same thing....but when your talking about the stock part, then again, the numbers obtained from the stock moor will yield a comparison to go by. ain't nothing wrong with hand picking a stock part (read that as an OEM part). as long as you don't change the basic numbers.

with all this being said, i'll be following the ARL closely as Dallas isn't that far from me and who knows? I might decide to make a road trip and race! :)
 
Racing isn't cheap. Never has been, never will be. If you can't afford to run with the money then ride in the back.. or take up a different hobby.
 
wrong answer....true, racing is not cheap....the problem comes with those who think that winning is everything and the only thing. I race for fun. but racers are their own worst enemy and they (and I include myself) are the reason that costs have skyrocketed and the reason that so many rules have to be made to keep others from cheating....

the original post was "affordable racing league"......spending more money than my budget allows because you (not meaning you as in YOU, just a statement) have to buy the latest and greatest to either circumvent the rules or because anything less than winning means you run to the promoter saying that the rules need to be changed because you got beat......the lo206 is not the answer to being affordable....and to me, it's just a way to justify the money that you spent on buying one of these motors.....again, this is not personal nor am I saying that YOU have or haven't done anything, it's just a statement to get my point across.....

and there isn't anything wrong with racing and being in the middle or back...consistency is more important than winning one race very four weeks and dropping out of all the others...
 
I just want to keep this in the loop. Please answer if you like...What do you BSP drivers spend on just (1) of your racing motors. I'm hearing 650 / 750 any higher or lower.
 
I'm spending $1050 for my clones, race ready other than clutch. - We're almost back into the Animal price range with the clones... Phew....
 
dallas....depending on the rules as they are written, affordability can be a good thing. it's when others, and no I'm not pointing anyone out, spend way more than necessary all for the sake of winning or just to brag that they have $1000 in their motors. any motor can be as expensive or as cheap as the rules make them. it's when you take advantage of the rules with the twisted cams and rewelding to circumvent the rules. this will kill any class no matter what engine you have....yes, even the lo206.....what is sealed by one man can be unsealed by another...sorry but you'll never be able to tell me different. no, I don't have any proof, but if the rules were honestly adhered to, then you wouldn't have to hire a tech man to keep the class equal. as much research that has gone into the lo206, I can almost promise you that just as much research has gone into ways to get into the motor to change it to gain any advantage..

I apologize to those that think the lo206 is the holy grail to racing....but it ain't. a good set of rules with a clear understanding that you will be dq'ed, fined, barred, embarrassed, toss out on your can...whatever....you can go far and get a good crowd of racers as long as you make it well know that absolutely nothing clearly defined as illegal will be tolerated...

still going to watch this class and see how it progresses!
 
dallas....depending on the rules as they are written, affordability can be a good thing. it's when others, and no I'm not pointing anyone out, spend way more than necessary all for the sake of winning or just to brag that they have $1000 in their motors. any motor can be as expensive or as cheap as the rules make them. it's when you take advantage of the rules with the twisted cams and rewelding to circumvent the rules. this will kill any class no matter what engine you have....yes, even the lo206.....what is sealed by one man can be unsealed by another...sorry but you'll never be able to tell me different. no, I don't have any proof, but if the rules were honestly adhered to, then you wouldn't have to hire a tech man to keep the class equal. as much research that has gone into the lo206, I can almost promise you that just as much research has gone into ways to get into the motor to change it to gain any advantage..

I apologize to those that think the lo206 is the holy grail to racing....but it ain't. a good set of rules with a clear understanding that you will be dq'ed, fined, barred, embarrassed, toss out on your can...whatever....you can go far and get a good crowd of racers as long as you make it well know that absolutely nothing clearly defined as illegal will be tolerated...

still going to watch this class and see how it progresses!

I agree with Mikey 100%
 
I'm not going to name names.but I've talked with two guys InThe last two months that have been in karting 30 plus years. And a kart shop owner thats no longer with us, when we first opened DMS. They all agree that the sanctioning bodys that are big in our sport ie the ones that make the rules are hurting the sport again for the budget racer or to put it plainly the guy that works hard for his money and can only afford $1000 per year total for there entire race budget. Old flat head guys does this sound right remember the 90s...to qoute from my freinds at he NFL. "COME ON MAN" its time -ARL- The rules will make sense. ...
 
thanks dallad mini speedway!! i'llbe looking forward to seeing what the rules are and how things are progressing..
 
I know this is not easy to get somthing like this Rollin. I have read a lot of good idea's and many things that could work...I don't think the lo206 is for the racers at DMS... We will be trying to focus on the predator motor and develope a rule base of standards. I do like the rental engine concept... its the cost to DMS up front that would be tuff to handle...But there no doubt about keepin it fair...thanks to all for your help and comments. ..please keep it coming just the fact of the views and replies let us know ---ARL--- CAN WORK!!!!

Don't do the rental part, make each driver purchase their own motor and provide it to the track as part of the entry fee. After the first race they are required to leave it with the track and put a serial number on it . For the second race you draw numbers for motors to get one at random, and also turn it back in at the end of the race. That's basically a rental with all cost up front.
 
only thing wrong with that is leaving the motor after you pay for it. i, for one, wouldn't like that. what's the answer? don't know. we all have to rely on each other to follow the rules and act accordingly. i think that a standard configuration of the motor would be the best and easiest. known parts with known part numbers, purchased from the track would be one way. that controls the cams, headers, etc....if you get someone, like mentioned before, that wants to twist the cam or monkey with it, then the tech rules would come into play and the lift and duration would be off from what the legal cam would be. i'm not talking about getting wild with the parts, but one cam, one header....things like that. carbs are easy to tech with a go/nogo gauge....vavles? let em use stainless....just have to be stock sizes only.

paying for the motor and then having someone take it and race it? not my idea of cricket. you could get one that they let get oil starved on purpose, knowing that they won't chose that motor again...too many variables that i wouldn't want to chance it. and the speedway doesn't have the capital (if i'm reading this right) to pay for a rebuild on any of the motors that they would hold to make sure that they are good for the next race. using your example, IF i was an unscrupulous racer and didn't give a hoot about anyone else, then i'd monkey with the motor before i turned it in, marked it so that i would know which is which and make sure that i don't get that motor.....even on a randon drawing, i'd refuse the motor....and you would be hard pressed not to let the racers chose which motor they wanted...because the one that they used last week seemed weak on power and that is one that they don't want...see where i'm going? it would cause more problems than it would solve.

the track should get one motor, build it to a track spec and then use it as a baseline for all teching. everyone else would have to build the motor using the exact same parts and if your motor doesn't measure up to the tech standard, then your history!! (you also have to allow leeway so that your not tossing everyone out!).....
 
I would be ok would be ok with leaving it. I'm paying a lot more than $100/motor. My thoughts are this would really be designed for local racers, at their home tracks. Most budget racers aren't going to that many different tracks anyway are they? I know nothing about building engines. If I have to put in specific cams and parts, I can tell you, I would be out. I would have to pay someone to help with that. Thats why I buy my motors. My thoughts are this is like a claimer in the fact that the track is claiming all the motors every race. I would run it as a class. You would not have to run that class. But.... if you wanted to these are the rules.

Entry fee Race 1, One Harbor freight predator engine plus Insurance costs
I would have them set up and sealed, and given out by random drawing
I would not let you protest a motor. You draw it you race it. If you ran it oil starved last race, you might be running it again, so you better take good care of it.
At the end of the race every motor is "Claimed by the track, and stored at the track.
run a 10 race points system, and drop the worst race points.

If the track is thinking of rentals anyway I would almost break even over 10 races and that would almost guarantee me coming back to THAT track again, because I would have an investment in it. Heck is your just racing for fun make the motor the entry fee for the year, and just make me pay for the pit pass/insurance. As for the track, This would put a burden on the track to maintain them, but It might be a risk or burned they are willing to accept.

This is not the perfect scenario, but I think it would be something I would go for. It would be a basic stock engine class , that I can't tamper with because I don't have the ability to unless I do it before i submit the motor, but then I cant be sure i get it every time anyway so I might be giving someone else the advantage. I'm paying over $600/motor. So I could do this 6 times and still save money.
 
[sarcasm on]
Maybe working on the chassis and tires should be illegal also. :) That would save more money than the motors.
[sarcasm off]
 
You think clones are expensive? Try racing in the SCCA Super Touring class - you are looking at 20K beyond the doner car to race per season.

Maybe we should ask our elected officials to subsidize the entry level racer?

Shoot, once the feds catch on to all the toxic chemicals the dirt folks are putting into the groundwater (tire-preps) - you WILL meet expensive! I guarantee!
 
Bob Evans...their can be no perfect solution to all the issues in this sport. But the engine cost, for what started out to be a stock class has grown into a monster. With no end in sight...The clone was to bring life back into a sport that was on the decline. We needed the clone just not all the rules that opened the flood gates to the $1000 motor. It takes effort to make change. I not sure that many people would mind a tight set of simple rules that would insure competitive racing motors at a great price. This can be done. We just need a leeder to leed us. In a lot of way this sport can be compared to another system we all know about....(Come on Man) we can do better...it will start small and grow...
 
Back
Top