Daytona Classes

So will this be like the Tag classes, where if after the practice day one engine has the clear advantage, the weight breaks will be adjusted?
 
Im in there with steve...i supported you guys making a class for the pro gas to get more entries for road racing and 4 cycle as a whole, but we dont need to be messing with a working combo aka the alky animal classes. I understand pro gas has worked great for gold cup and thats awesome...i just dont want this to become a hot engine for different tracks competition. I just dont want to see this hurt the already existing alky classes because now you have made the alky classes much less valuable on a given weekend when you can run pro gas twice and only alky once. If enduro is headed in the pro gas path then you guys are ahead of the game, but i hate to see one of the strongest classes change when its well represented and didnt need a change up. I guess in the end i would just like to see the pro gas in its own class by itself at least for a year...just like limited mod/clone/lo206 who had to be local option classes for at least a year...just to compare laptimes at all the tracks and then make a proper weight adjustment to possibly combine them. Just my 2 cents...not trying to tear apart any of the work MGM or Steve Baker has done to promote and grow the sport.

Mike Stroik
 
The weight break if needed will be adjusted after Kershaw .
I can't see the gas class overshadowing the alky class .
The gas class grew in the Gold Cup mainly because it had cash awards , at the last gold cup race myself along with GT Machine ( they put up first place money ) offered money for the alky class .
I understand Mike but for the life of me ,I can't understand SteveK and his dislike of the gas class .
We are just trying to help grow and keep the animal class strong . If this hurts the classes , I will be the first one to say that I messed up . Also there were or are guys down here that contacted me and wanted this class .
Good Luck to everyone that goes to the first two races !!!
Also a big thanks needs to be given for Jerry Cole at MKS !!!


Peewee. MGM Fab
 
Interesting. I can assure this did not go through the Road Race Competition committee. Looks like just pushed through by Trustees.
:(
 
I am sorry that I must of over step by bounds !! I will help sponsor this class

Any other questions about this class need to be directed to the committee or the tech men !
Thanks
See ya at Daytona

Peewee. MGM Fab
 
Peewee y'all got me off the ledge on the notion of having a separate Gas Pro RR class, but what does it accomplish by allowing Gas Pro in with the Alky?

Number one, I know the Gas Pro is supposed to be the greatest thing ever, but if I run a clone, LM, or Alky, I only have one opportunity to race each day. Gas gets two races?

Number two, if I want to compete in the Animal class I now need to bring another engine, another fuel system, and devote a few practice runs to either engine, just to make sure I don't show up and get beat because the equivalency was wrong for the biggest Enduro of the year? I'm seriously reevaluating my plans. It sounds like a few others might be as well.

Tell me what I'm missing here.
 
I am all for having more 4-cycle options. I am also a process person. IF we have a process for approval of classes (which we do, the RR comp committee), then it should go through that committee. Not rely on any one person who may have a vested interest.

I am not for or against it, because I don't know enough about it. I don't race Gold Cup, so I don't get to deal with all of those interactions.
Peewee, thanks for sponsoring a class, I wouldn't care if it was a two-cycle class, at least you are helping in that respect.
 
I agree with jack...dont want to put peewee down at all for the work he has done but id like to the see the gas class separate from the alky class for atleast a year. Testing at all tracks can be done to figure out the correct weight breaks before its thrown into the biggest road race event of the year.

Mike Stroik
 
I have no vested interest in any motor building shop


I didn't make the class

I did talk to a couple officials from WKA but I didn't set in on any meeting

I did itbecause several guys called me and asked about it

If anyone had a comment or complaint or idea Try like I did and call Wka

This shall be my last comment about this subject !!

See ya in Daytona !!!

Peewee. MGM Fab
 
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Peewee, I am not implying you have a vested interest in this class. I don't either, but some of the decision makers and shakers Do!
 
Steve, your not missing a thing. you see the same thing happening in RR today, that wiped out dirt and gold cup. History has showed you what worked, and what hasn't.
Were back to the same old 'We'll adjust weight if we have to story" Remember the beginning of Tag when there was so many engines, remember when they crammed the Cadet chassis into the reg chassis classes in M Cup. How much money did racers **** away trying to keep up with those changes ?
Using wt as a performance equalizer, is totally dependent on the number of corners at each track you have to accelerate that weight out of. Shape and speed of corners (RPM drop) are a part of that. Now, how are you going to relate Daytona, to a track like Grattan, or Kershaw, or VIR, there all so different from each other. Nothing will be the same.
Now consider that WKA goes to each track once each year, each track brings in different drivers with different skill levels, equipment and set up abilities, how are you going to factor in all those things? I wouldn't even consider going to Daytona with out a complete set kart for each class, then as Steve noted, hope you get enough practice to get each one dialed in. That will be like that for every track
Guys that isn't a cup of beer their handing you, its Kool Aid, don't drink the Kool Aid
WKA has a history of trying to provide every possible class in the hopes that someone will drop one more $100 bill to enter. What they don't see is the people 10-20-30 at a time that have just had enough of this, and no longer come because its too split up.
I agree that Pro Gas is on a roll right now because of Gold Cup, but look through the last 10 years of classes offered in GC What happened to the Subaru/Robin, the real Honda, the World Formula, all had someone behind them at one point. RR has gone from all BP Animal to L/M, then cloans, then LO206, now this. I'm really proud that we were part of this when it was one class, every racer ran it, and we had 40 people in it.

Jack asked the most important question, How did this even get in without going through the RR commitee? I know the people with the answer are reading this, How bout an answer?
 
I agree with Bob V. mixing classes will be vary hard to keep the Pro Gas and Alky on the same level of competition. With an official Animal Pro Gas class now i really do not see why they need to mix the Alky and Pro Gas classes in one.

Steve
 
I'll go one further, the two classes should never be combined. It's as a ridiculous a notion as combining animal and clone, or LO206 and LM. If you agree, Please let WKA know this. Send them an email and include your WKA member ID number, or you will be dismissed.
 
Have any of you guys ran "TaG"? Jon did for a couple years on the late 2000's before switching to Stock Honda. Let me tell you ................ TaG has been the "motor of the month" class since it's inception. Some motors are better at the longer Sprint tracks, some are faster at the shorter tracks ( better torque band I guess ). Not one, except maybe now the ROTAX is good at all tracks. I'm hoping Stock Animal Alky / Pro Gas does not end up the same way. Mike has a good point about Pro Gas being a Local Option class the first year as LT MOD was, Clone, etc. was when those classes first started out.

Another thing ........... Steve Baker said his Pro Gas motors were $850 if I remember correctly (??). Not having the rule book in front of me, where is the major difference as to why the Pro Gas is that price and the Alky Sr. Animal is about $1500? Just asking. Not trying to stir anything up, but makes me think.

Dave E.
 
Dave E.

Animal Pro Gas - Baker standard price for this engine is $895.00 and we currently are running a fall sale at $795.00 good till Dec 15th. Why such a cost difference? First of all our WKA Animal Alky engines are $1350.00 not $1500.00. The primary difference in the cost for the Pro Gas is time to build. The WKA Animal Pro Gas Spec #705 specifications have eliminated the time it takes to install the camshaft for best performance and all the alky carb modifications. Also no need to bore the block and install the oversize piston because only a standard bore is legal. The other factor for our shop is the arrangement of our tools and equipment for efficiency and reduced time to build. When we developed our $895.00 selling price it was based on the profit level we need to be viable business and what was fair for our customers, not what we felt the market would bare and what’s the most profit we could make! We are not part of the race engine building cartel!
Thanks to Briggs & Stratton for supplying us an engine that has parts with high quality and minimal part to part dimensional variation. This helps to reduce build time when you pretty much know what the parts are going to measure when building these engines. I think you would be surprised how easy these engines are to build,its almost like second nature in our shop.

We have enjoyed taking calls from other engine builders over the past few months and explaining to them how to build this engine and welcome all the questions you have for us!

Thanks
Steve
 
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