fatory hologram seal

To answer your question, IKF has yet to encounter a duplicated seal. The hologram is only one of the determining factors when the subject of 206 seal compliance arises.
 
Gonzari said:
To answer your question, IKF has yet to encounter a duplicated seal. The hologram is only one of the determining factors when the subject of 206 seal compliance arises.
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If it were duplicated......it would be encountered without recognizing it.
 
DarthDuck said:
If it were duplicated......it would be encountered without recognizing it.
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Why yes it would, I'll rephrase the question----Has anyone seen or heard of a present day hologram seal, trying to being duplicated (illegally)

Thankfully Darth you could never be duplicated....:)
 
No, I have not. I even offered up a $250 bounty to anyone that could produce such an item. 4 years and no one has came to me yet with one. Lots of people say they can, yet nobody does.

-Shannon
 
GoFastHP said:
No, I have not. I even offered up a $250 bounty to anyone that could produce such an item. 4 years and no one has came to me yet with one. Lots of people say they can, yet nobody does.

-Shannon
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If such an item were produced as asked............it would be to your advantage to assert it to be not bogus, but valid. Counterfeit currency is passed daily in the US......and bank workers duly trained to recognize the difference often accept the counterfeit bills as valid. Only crude copies are readily visible.
 
GoFastHP said:
...................... 4 years and no one has came to me yet with one..........................-Shannon
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How would you recognize an accurately similar counterfeit? That is the purpose of counterfeit.........."to fool the experts".

Up the offer.......to $250,000................if truly not possible...........no risk of payment.
 
Is there a race which would be worth winning to justify the cost of having these seals replicated? What would it cost to have 2 of these made to cheat up your engine? If you thought it would be profitable to have many produced, how would you market them? I don't think it is so much the seal, but the integrity of the rule package that makes this program appealing. It usually is not hard to notice something is amiss at the track, if the tech person doesn't notice it planty of others do. Usually a competitor doesn't go in and do a little cheat, he goes in to do the cheat that is going to make the difference and they stand out like a sore thumb.

We saw it a competitor in junoir that could not get out of his own way all season, decides to try the senior slide, guess what he is now in the pack and in everybody else way he was noticed.
 
Kart43 said:
Is there a race which would be worth winning to justify the cost of having these seals replicated? What would it cost to have 2 of these made to cheat up your engine? If you thought it would be profitable to have many produced, how would you market them? I don't think it is so much the seal, but the integrity of the rule package that makes this program appealing. It usually is not hard to notice something is amiss at the track, if the tech person doesn't notice it planty of others do. Usually a competitor doesn't go in and do a little cheat, he goes in to do the cheat that is going to make the difference and they stand out like a sore thumb.

We saw it a competitor in junoir that could not get out of his own way all season, decides to try the senior slide, guess what he is now in the pack and in everybody else way he was noticed.
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Not all deceptive acts are undertaken for the sake of profit........some simply for personal satisfaction of fooling those that claim it "can't be done"........or other personal reasons.
 
If someone wants to cheat bad enough they will.
If someone wants to make illegal seals they could do so. Just get out the credit card.
Money buys just about everything these days.
The seal being used is a deterrent and i'm guessing it's is not impossible to duplicate.
The idea that you don't have to do tech on a LO 206 is foolish. The integrity of a racing program demands there be tech as well as the competitors.
There are rules that are in place to check cam profile and bore and stroke without removing the seals.
Someone please tell me what you would cheat in the block other than those 3 items.

When i did tech at the 4 Cycle Showdown in Phoenix last November i checked the seals very carefully and didn't find anything unusual.
I didn't stop there and inspected all the other engine tech items and didn't find anything wrong with any of the engines teched.
I will add that it was one of the most fun races i've been to in a long time.
Since i didn't have a dog in the fight I could enjoy it with out any angst and the top 6 Cadet kids changed positions almost every lap. (very exciting)
I will add that they also raced the cleanest race i have seen in a long time.
The bottom line is that the LO 206 is an inexpensive engine package that gives every one the same Horsepower and provides years of fun.
It truly levels the playing field.

If you are thinking of getting into a LO 206 i wouldn't let someone scare you by telling you that the seals can be cheated..
Go for it you'll be happy you did.
 
Any talk of reproducing seals is ridiculous. Any money used to obtain them is better spent elsewhere, like in practice time for instance. As Jimbo mentioned everything that matters inside the crankcase can be teched. Discussions and arguments regarding this subject begins with a lack of knowledge or an agenda. Gets tired after awhile.
 
Seems it would be reasonable for Briggs to supply each person charged with verifying a seal with an electronic Hologram Reader, which can either accept or deny the validity of any examined seal, eliminating possible eyesight or judgment error, assuring integrity of the program.
 
Why, that only adds cost to a package that has real tech behind it to stop anyone from actually cheating. Can be done with the seal on and is fairly easy. So, that is pointless.
 
DarthDuck said:
Not all deceptive acts are undertaken for the sake of profit........some simply for personal satisfaction of fooling those that claim it "can't be done"........or other personal reasons.
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Then you have to question the character of the person so deadest on cheating, then using the excuse "it can be done". I have not come across anyone in motorsports cheating who did it so they can claim "it can be done". I find it disturbing people are willing to go to such great lengths and expense all in the name of winning a $10 trophy at the end of the day.
 
I wonder what you would actually do to the bottom end if you could fool the seal police? A stroker crank or hot cam can be found without opening the side cover. I guess you could lighten things or polish them for less friction but any gains you make would be very small. Certainly not worth the trouble of faking the seal.
 
As some have already shared, these motors are so close when one compares performance, that ears & eyes are the first indicator long before they roll into tech. From the "for what it's worth" department, Briggs is focused on maintaining the integrity of it's brand, so betterment is on the horizon as it relates to factory seals.
 
I wonder what you would actually do to the bottom end if you could fool the seal police? A stroker crank or hot cam can be found without opening the side cover. I guess you could lighten things or polish them for less friction but any gains you make would be very small. Certainly not worth the trouble of faking the seal.
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Oh, there's plenty that could be done that would make a difference. Simply taking some tension off of the oil ring expander would be worth pulling it apart. Not worth breaking the seals and subsequent penalty incurred, however. There's a reason that these engines run stronger after they get some time on them. I have guys that regularly ask me for used LO206 engines or how much I would charge to run them (more than break-in) under load on the dyno for several hours. Cylinder clearance and ring seal are just part of the equation. There are also some interesting developments in metallurgy that these engines could benefit from. I've already seen it done (and work) in the clones and flatheads. It's on the horizon and coming quickly. I don't know that it'll revolutionize karting like tire prepping did, but it's out there.

Just another benefit of having that sealed bottom end! Briggs is looking at several new things to maintain the integrity of the sealed engine program. One that I'm aware of would help tremendously -- logistically it will be difficult, but tracking every individual engine is something that CAN be done - the technology to do so is already available.
Thanks Briggs for forward thinking rather than retro-active.

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