getting a burris 33 ready for raceday

RCZ racer said:
what is the best way to get a brand new burris 33 slick ready for race day. we are racing on a 1/8 dirt oval.
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This will really depend on your race track and how much bite it offers.
Generally, you will want to have them cut (flat, intermediate, round, full round) depending on if you need to free the kart up on high grip surfaces or create sidebite for low/no bite surfaces. The depth of the rubber also plays an important role. With new out of the wrapper 33s around .110", on a small 1/8 bullring track, you usually won't see a huge difference in cutting the tires thin, whereas on a bigger momentum track you usually see better lap times with thinner rubber. Then consider that more rubber holds more prep (if you need it.)
Then what prep do you need....anything internal? About half of our 33 inventory has inside prep in them. For bigger tracks and higher grip you generally don't want internal in 33s. For smaller or low bite tracks we use internal preps.
Outside prep depends on your track surface as well. How soft, how much bite, etc can be altered through the use of a variety of preps.

Your best bet might be to get with someone local to work with on your tire program, but don't be afraid to step out of your area and consider some of the tire guys on here who can help you as well.
We'd be glad to work with you if you would like to give us a call and we can talk about what would be best for your track and your tire program.



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Thanks and God bless,
Brian Carlson
Carlson Racing Engines
Vector Cutz
www.CarlsonMotorsports.com
27 years of service to the karting industry
Linden, IN
765-339-4407
bcarlson@CarlsonMotorsports.com
 
So how long can prep stay inside a tire before loosing it's punch and how many races will a tire prepped inside last before needing more prep? thanks
 
rwracer said:
So how long can prep stay inside a tire before loosing it's punch and how many races will a tire prepped inside last before needing more prep? thanks
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That will depend on a number of things as well....How much prep was rolled internally, what brand/type of prep, what other preps were used in conjunction with the internal.

Internal preps will permanently "alter" the tire, but the "punch" that you are talking about is how effective it is. The number of heat cycles that a tire has been run through will also determine the longevity of the prep in the tire. The hotter a tire gets, the more it pulls some chemicals through the rubber. Just being exposed to the atmosphere starts the depletion of some chemicals in the prep itself through evaporation and other means.
Some internal preps are "once and done," others last only through a few heat cycles before they lose their effectiveness. (Check with your prep manufacturer or dealer on your specific prep and application.)
Our Pink Panther seems to still work well after 20-25 heat cycles in Burris 33s, whereas it goes away much quicker in Maxxis on higher bite, higher temp tracks. Pink Panther, when used internally on sprint car and dirt late model tires may need re-treated after just 2 or 3 race days where tire temps are much greater. Our Medium Rare (mostly used as internal on pavement tires) the effectiveness drops off significantly after only 5 or 6 heat cycles.
Internal preps can (and often are) re-applied or re-rolled when necessary. What you need to be careful of is that while an internal prep can lose some of it's effectiveness over time, much of the chemical is still in the tire, and re-activating that remaining chemical does not necessarily mean a complete re-treatment with the same amount of that internal chemical. For example, let's say that you rolled 2 ounces of our Pink Panther in the right side tires. The race that you expected to use them at is cancelled and you don't normally run a track where you need that much internal. Let's say that the tires sit for 2 months until the rescheduled race date. Typically, I would suggest that you re-roll with the same internal product, but half as much 1-2 weeks before the rescheduled event. Other preps and manufacturers may have their own recommendations. Again, check with them as they know their product best.
One thing to be careful of (especially with Burrs tires which tend to wear a long time before losing roll speed) is to not roll too much internal into them. The result will not be a faster tire, but a HEAVY tire.
 
Thanks for the detailed explanation...I see where we can always learn something new from prepping tires, truly an Art!
 
Thanks Brian for the info. I am going to save this post when we start moving up in classes. Right now we are on a high bite 1\8th medium banking dirt oval kam kartway. We just finished our first full season in a 3.5 beginner class. My 7yr old got better as the year went on. We ran a Burris slick 22 on left and right rear every race. There were a few instances I wish I had a 33 for the RR because the track did dry out. That was just a few times though. I have talked to other dads and they say that prep won,t make a difference until he moves up in HP. For now I have been sanding a thin layer off my 22,s with 80 grit sander before races. I do it just enough to see fresh rubber and to knock the glaze off.
At some point next year we will be moving to a blue plate clone class. I,m assuming that is when the prepping will play a factor.
Do u think that sanding is OK for now until we move up in class?
 
RCZ racer said:
Thanks Brian for the info. I am going to save this post when we start moving up in classes. Right now we are on a high bite 1\8th medium banking dirt oval kam kartway. We just finished our first full season in a 3.5 beginner class. My 7yr old got better as the year went on. We ran a Burris slick 22 on left and right rear every race. There were a few instances I wish I had a 33 for the RR because the track did dry out. That was just a few times though. I have talked to other dads and they say that prep won,t make a difference until he moves up in HP. For now I have been sanding a thin layer off my 22,s with 80 grit sander before races. I do it just enough to see fresh rubber and to knock the glaze off.
At some point next year we will be moving to a blue plate clone class. I,m assuming that is when the prepping will play a factor.
Do u think that sanding is OK for now until we move up in class?
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For the kid karts / rookie / putt putt / whatever the tracks call it (beginners), it's all about seat time. Generally, if there's a spec gear and/or spec tire size, we try to free up the kart (mainly with air pressure) to get mph. It's not uncommon to run 20-22 psi in the tires of a kid kart -- sure, the kart handles like a po-go stick, but it's fast as long as the driver can handle it.
I would agree, that prep plays a lesser part in what you are doing right now....BUT, that's not to say that your driver wouldn't feel more comfortable with more grip in the tires, or turn faster lap times with prepped tires. My thought is that if you don't have to prep, then don't. There have been nights at our track where one (or both) of my boys have only had one or two other cars to compete against. There's no reason to prep if you don't have to and still win. On the other hand, when you do move into a class with larger car count, it is very likely that you will need to prep to be competitive. You might as well start learning as soon as possible. By learning, I also mean "safety" with your young driver. Safety in handling chemicals, being around them (touching, breathing, etc.) tires. Washing, sanding, re-prepping, etc. A lot of responsibility needs taught as well as just painting on "magic glue" to make jr faster.
When you get to a very competitive class / race, you will find that Burris seem to work better if they are "fresh" before each run, ie sanded and re-prepped before going on the track each time. This is why most racers at big events will put on a new set each time they hit the track. They've already taken the time to prepare their tires at the shop the previous week or two before the race. For those on a budget, it may mean having to drag the tire refinishing equipment to the track with us to clean the tires up after each heat cycle. Keep in mind, that each time you sand, you're removing some of the prep that you previously worked into that tire. See, we don't wear out tires (33's anyhow) on most tracks, we wear them out with belt sanders and flap wheels. :)
For now, sanding, and cleaning with a good tire cleaner might well be adequate. You most certainly will have to start playing the prep gamer sooner or later though.
 
Brian,
Thx for taking the time to answer my questions. There is a professional karter close to me that advertises a tire prep program. So i don,t get ripped off what should i reasonably expect to pay for a weekly tire program. Also what tire prep do u recommend with burris slicks. Hopefully i will learn the tire prep game one day and start doing it myself. Thx again.
 
RCZ racer said:
Brian,
Thx for taking the time to answer my questions. There is a professional karter close to me that advertises a tire prep program. So i don,t get ripped off what should i reasonably expect to pay for a weekly tire program. Also what tire prep do u recommend with burris slicks. Hopefully i will learn the tire prep game one day and start doing it myself. Thx again.
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No need to pay anyone weekly, just have someone cut them and roll them internally ( if needed ) $60 bucks, then choose prep line and learn procedure and wipe during the week yourself and at the track, If the tire guy will not give you Instruction on what to do, Find a different one.
 
^ Agreed. No need to pay for weekly services if you can handle the task yourself.
Some racers choose to have someone local do the work for them (refinishing, re-prepping) while other save that money and do the work themselves.
We ship sets of tires all over the country - if we did all of the refinishing, etc for these guys every week, I'd have to hire 20 employees full time and still have no time to race myself. :) Most guys start with a good set of tires, then maintain their tire sets themselves.
You will want to have the tires cut by someone experienced with a tire lathe. After that, continue the maintenance we discussed previously.
If you'd like to give me a call at the shop, I'd be glad to discuss our services and what you can expect.


-----
Thanks and God bless,
Brian Carlson
Carlson Racing Engines
Vector Cutz
www.CarlsonMotorsports.com
27 years of service to the karting industry
Linden, IN
765-339-4407
bcarlson@CarlsonMotorsports.com
 
I have a jr3 driver and we are running indoor low bite ag dirt. Burris rule.
We are having trouble with qualifying, I've tryed anywhere from 42-48 on the duro,still 3-4 tenths off.
I'm starting to wonder if these dads are killing their tires and running super low air?
 
Goat or Krug,4# air,could be your setup,need lots of stagger indoors..list your chassis nd setup and what indoor track.central city or russellville
 
when you say you have tried everything from 42 to 48 what did you use to get them there, and wiped during the week, or only at the track, or both, and I would assume your talking about 33's.
 
Yes 33s, wiped a medium bite prep once a day race week couple wipes of goat at track.
Or should I wipe a couple days before to get duro where I want it then wipe bite at track?
Thought about dropping a set down to about 30 for his qualifying laps
 
Lowbudgetkarter said:
Yes 33s, wiped a medium bite prep once a day race week couple wipes of goat at track.
Or should I wipe a couple days before to get duro where I want it then wipe bite at track?
Thought about dropping a set down to about 30 for his qualifying laps
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are you then racing on same tires, and if so are you getting better results during the race, are you sure goat is working for others, are your 33's cut, if so which profile.
 
Seems like around here western ky and tenn jhe guy who knows how to get grip the best is one of the best, I never really hear much about locked down around here
 
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