Kart race engines vs. the big displacement....

Taft Racing said:
There seems to be a slight miss conception here on what the UAS is right now. The UAS is not WKA or AMA or Wwo or any way shape or form a high dollar fully funded organization. We charge 40.00 to become a member, and 35.00 of that goes directly into the point fund for the GN, Jeff Davis has never to my knowledge excepted a dime for his part in points keeping. So those funds are also kicked in to the GN. What's left covers mostly postage and paper costs. Wher eon earth would we pull the cash to offer payouts or travel expenses or any kind of UAS backed monetary backing for racers.

Getting backing from tire distributors kart manufacturers ect is directly related to what's in it for them. We are a tiny fraction of the karting world. By no means do we have the clout to start making demands on any manufacturer to step up and payout.

This is a work in progress , The UAS used to be just a few local series around PA and OH, It grew mostly on the eastern sea board. The National Championship was brought about to help promote more interest in UAS open modified kart racing. WKA IKF all those traditional kart racing organizations were dropping the open class. again they were catering to where the money is the stocker classes.

7-8 years ago the UAS was mostly a Sudam spec class, every where you went it was out casts of the former WKA IKF and local open class racers looking for a place to race. I a very short time we've turned some heads Nation wide. We have become a growing class in a down turn economy. We've spread all across the country, Look at the Arizona event. absolutely fantastic, It was just about 5 years ago those guys out west were not even on the map as far as recognized UAS contenders. Now they have the seeds to begin to challenge the east coast in kart numbers and growth.

Burris sponsors allot of kart racing. But again they pay out where the money is in their best interest. same as your fishing sponsors. Put the money in where you'll gain the most return. Open modified racing isn't where Burris or Maxxis or Hoosier or Dunlop or Phantom or any other manufacturer is going to see a return on their investment.

We've cracked the window open with our GN. That's obvious. Manufacturers are starting to see some possible return in the future. It's going to take numbers thou. Your not going to draw numbers from the karting world. Your going to have to seek out a new audience . The MX engine is more than just a engine that's being converted to karting. It has tens of thousands of racers, spectators, sponsors, aftermarket venders, ect ect ect. We will pull from those numbers, It will take time, we will gain new members new faces new interests. were only just begining.

What you want can be achieved but not over night. It takes investment and a constant never ending forward push, No doubt we'll gain a few speedway racers, but those guys are in the same boat we are. small unknown and not mainstream. Open modified kart racing with the MX engines may not be your choice. But it will benefit you directly. JMO.
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I have seen lately a lot of good people putting money out there to up the pay offs and to support the UAS

So thanks to

Seay hi performance
W C. Equipment
Track tac
BRC
Birky
Burris
Taft
Stohr
BRE racing
Bobby Baldwin
Olson karts
Jammer

And I know I'm missing some. If I did add for me
 
Yeah Thanks Steve I wasn't looking to slight any of our sponsor help. The sponsors of the Big O Charlie Stoffa, ProKart, Steve Gleason. Brian Abel, Ed Schriefels, TS racing. There are a ton of people that make this deal work. The Cherry family and business contributed so much this past year. We need to do a better job in supporting and making sure those who have stepped up get the support and recognition they deserve.
 
Swindle said:
Mitch, Maybe it is me but it seems like you are trying to talk someone out of the UAS because it is too expensive. I remember a race this summer where a wankel was in the lead, then one of Stephen Gleasons PK250 was in the lead, Baldwins 4 stroke 250 was in the lead and Bergfelts 131 was in the lead. Now Bergfelts kart has to be 10 years old, so you can run in the lead with these older karts. 2 years ago, my Son was tied for 1st in the UAS, with Robbie with his Wankel, and I think Westerfield might have been in there with his 450. Stevie only had a 125 sudam in which he won the Prelude to the National which had a couple wankels in it. In fact the fastest kart on that nite may have well been a 116 that a young guy was racing. I think you said before that you never were a UAS member or ran with us. I probably am not reading you right but it seems like there is some sort of resentment towards the UAS and I don't understand why. Please don't judge the UAS by the BS on this site, which is by no means an offical UAS site. Judge it by the racers who are 99% awesome, if you have a problem at the track, they will be right there with you trying to fix it. Several times we have had engine, clutch, J/S problems and someone delivers one to our trailer. The bickering that goes on here doesn't not go on at the track. How Mike Grady and me interact on Bob's is probably a perfect example. Honestly I can not stand him most of the time on here, but if I was running a race or helping, Mike would be one of the 1st guys I would ask to help me. I really like how he handles himself at the track, it's the next day on here that we have problems!LOL Sorry for rambling, I will shut up, if I can, Steve Sr.
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Steve,
I appreciate the vote of confidence regarding my track skills.

Regarding my posts, I always speak my mind, I don't beat around the bush, and I sign my name to my posts. If being straight forward and honest is a problem, I'm guilty as charged.
It doesn't matter if it is my best friend or someone I don't care much for, honesty is the best policy.

Maybe it has been the "Mark posts". Some people take it like I don't like him. Those people don't know me. I am speaking my opinion of how he has handled something. Too many times I have not come on here and stated how he has handled something well. You often only see the ones where I don't agree with him. Not agreeing isn't not liking. For some reason, many people can't seem to understand that is even possible. I can't fix that so I don't worry about it.

I don't always agree with Taft's take on stuff but again, he's a racer and that makes him good in my book.

Mike
 
Tim Iam just saying you guys are underrating the potential of what you have going. Where do ya think a large portion of karters from both WKA and IKF would like to go. Many would like to advance in the upper asphalt series. But there are many also that would jump at the chance to run a muscle kart in the UAS. I suspect that many of the WKA & IKF read and watch the videos from the UAS. You have to approach the sponser with a attitude that he will get his money worth from the entire karting world being interested in what is happening in the ultimate dirt series in the states. These sponserships can be had now. Its all about your presentation to them, name a race after them give them video coverage and their name flying on posters everywhere on the track. How much does it cost Burris or Maxis or vega to make 10 sets of tires. Calculate it at about 150% markup and figure it out. Its a very small amount in their world and they can rite off a portion on taxes. Make them understand that the product will also be seen racing in your series. I understand you dont want any tire rules and I agree. How much does it cost a chassis mamufactor to produce one, iam talking out of pocket money for them, labor and materials. Most important make them believe that you will support them and their particaption will benifit the company.This would help so many racers to supplement their racing budgets many more would try to enter to have a chance to win some money. But in the UAS way of looking at it if they will race for nothing why rock the ship. If the racers are content with the way things are everybodys happy.
 
Taft Racing said:
Yeah Thanks Steve I wasn't looking to slight any of our sponsor help. The sponsors of the Big O Charlie Stoffa, ProKart, Steve Gleason. Brian Abel, Ed Schriefels, TS racing. There are a ton of people that make this deal work. The Cherry family and business contributed so much this past year. We need to do a better job in supporting and making sure those who have stepped up get the support and recognition they deserve.
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The Big O race was not a UAS race! It is a stand alone race to honor a man that gave more to modified kart racing than any of us have ever done or probably will do! Otis was a personal friend of mine, I hope that the some people in the UAS are not going to try and make the Big O race about the UAS it is not nor should it ever be that would be very disrespectful to Otis! They offered an Unlimited class and they used the same rules that the UAS uses for that class structure and that was it! Nothing counted for the UAS and should not be thought of as a UAS event...... Mark didn't even know who Otis was or that we put on a race for him every year since 2008...
 
Mitchell. I agree with you 100%. We have so much potential. I'd like to get the tire manufactures to put up contingency money or tires. The uas provides a perfect format for that kind of competition amoungst manufacturers their products and awarding racers for racing and winning with their products. Thanks for your obvious pation for the sport.
 
One needs to carefully evaluate why they're doing UAS racing when making their engine and chassis choices.
For me, I enjoy the comraderie, learning the skills of "right foot driving" instead of momentum-based drafting and crash fests....
I also enjoy innovation, designing, building, and most of all -- VERY LITTLE TECH PROCESS.
Other than the nights we're late in the program, you can show up, prep your stuff and nobody fusses about what you brought, you go race with 5-25 other skilled racers, who, for the most part, won't push, shove, or dump you for position. If you want to be at the pointy end of the field, you gotta' pay your dues and open the checkbook. But though I enjoy winning, I'm realistic enough to know that my personal budget allows participation with hoping for the odd win due to sheer luck or others DNF'ing...
As it is, I got the pole for last years' Paradise UAS race in WNY by simply being consistent and that little 305 was solid and reliable. I'd wager a guess that anyone who got their equipment to approach 100% reliability and travelled to a couple of regions would end up top-15 in points, nationally.
It will be interesting to see how many "little" engines are run this year and how they do.
 
Taft Racing said:
Mitchell. I agree with you 100%. We have so much potential. I'd like to get the tire manufactures to put up contingency money or tires. The uas provides a perfect format for that kind of competition amoungst manufacturers their products and awarding racers for racing and winning with their products. Thanks for your obvious pation for the sport.
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Not directed at anyone, but lets not forget the Burris crew have invested plenty in a UAS orientated tire and brought something new to the table in regards to tires. Mike Burris took the time to attend the GN in Lasoski. Burris still has to outlay the cost of the tires whether they get sold or not. I'm just making the point that manufacturers are starting to take notice, you cant ask much more of them for now when UAS is just a small part of karting in the USA.
 
Ted Hamilton said:
One needs to carefully evaluate why they're doing UAS racing when making their engine and chassis choices.
For me, I enjoy the comraderie, learning the skills of "right foot driving" instead of momentum-based drafting and crash fests....
I also enjoy innovation, designing, building, and most of all -- VERY LITTLE TECH PROCESS.
Other than the nights we're late in the program, you can show up, prep your stuff and nobody fusses about what you brought, you go race with 5-25 other skilled racers, who, for the most part, won't push, shove, or dump you for position. If you want to be at the pointy end of the field, you gotta' pay your dues and open the checkbook. But though I enjoy winning, I'm realistic enough to know that my personal budget allows participation with hoping for the odd win due to sheer luck or others DNF'ing...
As it is, I got the pole for last years' Paradise UAS race in WNY by simply being consistent and that little 305 was solid and reliable. I'd wager a guess that anyone who got their equipment to approach 100% reliability and travelled to a couple of regions would end up top-15 in points, nationally.
It will be interesting to see how many "little" engines are run this year and how they do.
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Every area is different. If you have two speedway engines in your area, owned by guys that know tires, you better have your ducks in a row. You better have some serious hp too. It appears I will have 3 or 4 in my area, this year. Add several 250s and 450s as well.

If you have a bunch of competitive guys on big hp, you have to spend money IF you want to be competitive week in and week out. Yes, you can still race a 116 or a 305 but you won't be competing for many wins. Some guys are happy with just getting on the track......but not many. With the current weights, given what the average racer weighs, the weight breaks granted to the larger engines makes them a more likely choice for a racer that wants to be competitive for race wins.

There is the other route of dual engines but the typical frame is not an optimal package for their size and heft. You really need a larger chassis. That takes a load of work. Look at what Felch has done. Nothing is easy but does it have to be this difficult? It appears so. Sometimes that makes it fun.....well, interesting is a better word.

Mike
 
Well I will still run my little K30 and maybe I win maybe I don't but it is what I like to run. I run 1/5 mile and smaller so I'm happy with what I run. Maybe I can give Charlie and the boys here in NC a good run. But now I have to figure out setup and tires on this Carolina clay so it's almost like being a rookie again. Let the fun begin.

Frankie
 
1fastyammy said:
Well I will still run my little K30 and maybe I win maybe I don't but it is what I like to run. I run 1/5 mile and smaller so I'm happy with what I run. Maybe I can give Charlie and the boys here in NC a good run. But now I have to figure out setup and tires on this Carolina clay so it's almost like being a rookie again. Let the fun begin.

Frankie
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Have you moved to Carolina? I was not aware of that. Hope it goes well for you. You are a good man, and you reflect the goodness of
your Dad......Marty!!!
Hope to see you around! ..........Paul Doss
 
1fastyammy said:
Well I will still run my little K30 and maybe I win maybe I don't but it is what I like to run. I run 1/5 mile and smaller so I'm happy with what I run. Maybe I can give Charlie and the boys here in NC a good run. But now I have to figure out setup and tires on this Carolina clay so it's almost like being a rookie again. Let the fun begin.

Frankie
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Ive always done well in the Carolinas Frankie. You won't see much difference in track conditions. Great group of guys there to help as well.
 
Tim heres some suggestions for possible sponsership. During the off season is the time to approach the manufactors. Hit up Redline and blendsall and some of the other oil suppliers, for a case to be awarded at each national. Approach Mychron for a unit for each national event. Try all the tire manufactors for tires to award for the season of nationals ,even 5 sets per event.Chassis man. for a chassis with just sterring components, rear axel and brakes. They will still sell parts to finish kart tomake it race ready. Hit the wheel suppliers for some support too. Do not ask for monatary donations, ask for produts donations. Most manufactors are much more willing to make these type of supports. Ask TS and comet and Reikens what they might be willing to do in the way of product donations. Make some banners to put up at each race around the tracks at the national events.Post their names in UAS Magazine. Have drivers mention them in interviews Try and get them to sponser all the national events so the banners will work all season long. Someone in the membership must have acces to suppliers for the banners to be made cheap. These are just some suggestion off the top of my head. Many more possibilties are out there and IMO they are up for grabs.Now is the time to ask. I went to redline and approached them for support and was told that i needed to ask much earlier in the year and this was about april. They had already decided on where the support was going.
 
Oh most definitely Jerry, you are correct. We have multiple wins and track records on some of the fastest tracks with a 22 lb motor. But generally speaking, 90% of the time momentum tracks favor the big hp, and point and shoot tracks the lighter packages. :)
 
Yep showing up with a kart and Marty's big K30 on it and a spare K30 just in case. Gonna find a track up here to break it in sometime in Feb. I will see you down there.
 
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