Noram Stinger Service?

KochRacing

Member
I'm going to service the clutch this week, I seen online where they recommended cleaning and sanding the pads and drum. I've also seen mixed reviews on using WD40 and Brake Cleaner. And not much info on what to lube the thrust bearing and the driver bearings with. Any info is appreciated.
 
Stinger has metal shoes . Brake clean should be fine .
Vasiline for a lubricant light dab on thrust bearing and driver bearing .
Some prefer high temp grease . Again a very little on the thrust bearing and driver gear bearing .
 
Brake cleaner makes metal brittle because it pulls oils out of metal. I always used carb cleaner instead. Whether It would ever cause that condition in the life span of a drum and shoes I don’t really know but didn’t take any chances. I only sprayed them a couple times a year but I did sand the drum and shoes after every race and blew them out and off with air then wiped with a clean cloth. You don’t need to take hardly any material off to keep it fresh so go easy. Very fine sandpaper or sanding drum for a dremel tool. I used old wore out ones that were more like a polishing pad. Make sure you are using the right springs and have the shoes on the hub so they are driving and engaging the way you need them to.
 
I just looked at both cans . Methanol , toluene and acetone for brake clean.
Toluene , methanol and acetone for carb and air intake cleaner .
 
Per PJ1 website. Not trying to start an argument, but one is safe for rubber and such also, while the other isn’t. Just because they have 3 of the same ingredients doesn’t mean they do the same thing. Just some information to pass on.



Is Brake Cleaner and Carburetor Cleaner the Same?
In short, no they are not. If you are wearing a pair of nitrile gloves while you’re doing your cleaning they will hold up just fine to brake cleaner but will quickly turn into goo if you’re using carburetor cleaner. In this article, we’ll talk about the difference between brake cleaner and carburetor cleaner and when you should use each.
Brake cleaner is for cleaning brakes and carburetor cleaner is for cleaning carburetors. While yes, we are being sarcastic, it’s important to think about what each component requires when cleaning. When cleaning brake parts you of coarse want any unwanted dirt and debris removed but you especially want oil removed. Oil on your brakes tends to have the opposite effect of braking and can cause a big problem. On the other hand, when you’re cleaning your carburetor you similarly want dirt removed but you also may need to dissolve stubborn build up and at the end of the day, a little oil left on some surfaces might just help your carburetor function properly by free up stuck valves or linkages.
Since a completely oil-free surface is a requirement of brake components, it’s always important to clean them with brake cleaner. PJ1 Brake Cleaner is a professional formula with a high-pressure spray that will perfectly clean your brake components leaving them completely oil-free and ready for maximum braking power. However, this cleaned is extremely powerful and may damage rubber, plastics, painted surfaces or electrical components so it should be used carefully and only on not painted metal components.
If you do have electrical components that need to be cleaned use PJ1 Contact Cleaner! PJ1 Contact cleaner can remove carbon build-up dirt and dust from electrical components without harming them.
PJ1 Carburetor Cleaner is specially formulated for cleaning the varnish and tough deposits out of your carburetor to free stuck components and return your carb to like-new function! PJ1 Carburetor cleaner is also safe for rubber, vinyl and neoprene so if your carburetor has these types of seals or gaskets you won’t need to rebuild your carburetor after cleaning. While PJ1 Carburetor Cleaner may be less harmful to some surfaces than PJ1 Brake Cleaner, we recommend testing it on a small area first and keeping it away from plastics and painted surfaces as well.
 
Just relating what's on the ingredients list . non chlorinated chemicals are generally less aggressive .
Aromatic hydrocarbons -toluene is in that family .
I'll check it out .
 

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I'm not sure that article made your case . Though it did mention hydrogen embridlment , which I am familiar with .
Per the article .
SCC is the result of a combination of three factors – a susceptible material, exposure to a corrosive environment, and tensile stresses above a threshold. If any one of these factors are eliminated, SCC initiation becomes impossible.
 
Hydrogen embrittlement. On that wiki read under the see also section on environmental stress fractures. Doesn’t brake cleaner corrode the surface as it leaves hydrogen chloride behind causing the above especially on high strength steel such as grade 8 and above bolts etc which will cause embrittlement especially with elevated temperatures? FF9571C0-98B3-494A-A78F-9963F587CC7B.png

Just why I have always avoided using it maybe no need to worry but I try to not leave anything to chance.
 

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Elevated tempurature ; exactly how high is that ?
The use of non chlorinated Brake Cleaner should eliminate that issue .
Time and exposure factors must come into play as well .
Stress corrosion cracking and hydrogen embrittelment are both real and commonly related too welding .
The hub , springs and driver may be grade 8 and or high carbon content Steel .
Its possible that if you have a stress related fracture, the use of Brake Clean may have caused it .
Personally I have never had a clutch failure that can be directly related too Stress Corrosion Cracking .
 
That was my thought also about elevated temps. As I said I just avoided the brake cleaner to eliminate any worries. A lot of food for thought in those articles that most of us don’t ever think about and good reading if you are into that kind of stuff which Flattop I think you probably dove in and read most of it also
 
One thing that was left out of what I read above with regards to stress corrosion cracking and hydrogen embrittlement is the role of stress in the material in use, especially obvious in grade 8 fasteners, for instance. Each material susceptible to stress corrosion cracking and H2 embrittlement has a quality called Threshold Stress Level; the nominal Threshold stress level for Grade 8 steel is 80,000 psi tensile stress. Below that level of stress, stress corrosion cracking and H2 embrittlement are unlikely to occur in Grade 8 materials - a good reason to not over torque Grade 8 fasteners. Oh, and you need a moisture source for the H2. High humidity can be such a source; in the marine environment, that is defined as anywhere from 50 miles inland out to sea, so you don't have to be water born to have susceptibility based on climate. DoD studies of the failure of high strength steel fasteners (Grade 8 and higher) in helicopter rotor heads due to stress corrosion cracking and H2 embrittlement indicate a much higher failure rate at bases close to coastal areas than at bases well inland.

Just some more thoughts on the subject.
 
Post #9: tensile stresses above a threshold .
Your input is appreciated and spot on .

Now initially I think drum , springs and hub are in tension .
Shoes are in compression .
The springs are connected to the shoes , if the spring is in tension then some part of the shoe is as well .
Much more complicated when you look at the whole package .
 
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I actually work in a foundry and we produce magnesium and aluminum parts for the black hawk, the osprey etc we make rotor housings and a couple other parts for the helicopters, as well as many other aircraft parts and are actually making the body and nose section for the new cruise missile. They only use those parts so many hours, the harsher the environment the less hours they get out of them. We X-ray our products to check for all kinds of quality issues. We also soak them in a penetrant and then they go under a special light to find any other blemishes such as cracks, air pockets, low spots etc. We have an acid dip we use also to take a thousandth of an inch off the surface or more depending upon the needs. So long in the bath equals x amount of material removal or so many times dipped. I should ask our metallurgist about this stuff and see what he says about it. Would be interesting to hear his thoughts on it.
 
Elevated tempurature ; exactly how high is that ?
.
According to my friend, Bob Lawley, in 1980, senior metallurgical engineer at Lockheed aircraft Corporation, 50° would be considered an elevated temperature. Elevated from what I don't know. Hydrogen embrittlement in metals occurs during any plating process. Given enough time, hydrogen embrittlement, would, for lack of a technical term, dissipate at that temperature. Parts that are chrome plated are heated to, if I remember right, about 120 – 150° for heat treating. Above that temperature chrome tends to discolor. Still, it takes a lot less time to relieve the hydrogen embrittlement at that temperature. This was 40 years ago and I don't remember all the numbers. I'm sure they're available somewhere.
 
50* is evelvated from zero or -120* . My experience is all on the welding end .
At a welding seminar we put three specimens in glycerin .
6010 , 7018 and er71 wire.
You could see the hydrogen bubbles the next day , of course the 6010 produced the most the other 2 are low hydrogen fillers .
Anhydrous and Lng tanks are kept in the -20/-120 range or lower . Any Cracking is a big concern .
 
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Al, a small correction: the post plating heat treatment is not to remove the hydrogen embrittlement, it is to drive off the absorbed hydrogen so that hydrogen embrittlement doesn't occur.

Heat treatment of materials subject to H2 absorption during manufacture is a very common process - plating is not the only process source of H2 during manufacture, just the most common one. A prime example of plated high strength steel that karters may encounter is cadmium plated Grade 8 fasteners - you know, the ones that are gold colored instead of flat black. In my 30 year career in the field of submarine design and lifecycle engineering support, we would once in awhile encounter a failed cad plated high strength steel fastener and the failure analysis (loved those reports, especially the scanning electron microscope photos) usually lead to inadequate post plating heat treatment after manufacture as the cause. And , contrary, to common belief (a belief not discouraged by manufacturers, unfortunately) cad plating is NOT a good preventive for corrosion/rusting of fasteners in service, its real purpose is simply to prevent corrosion/surface rust of fasteners in storage between manufacture and point of sale and subsequent installation.
 
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