12jr champ
Member
I was trying to fix a push from the center off on asphalt.
R/F camber
- Thread starter 12jr champ
- Start date
Pete_Muller
Moderator
You're assuming that the right-front corner has positive scrub radius Al. It may have very little or none, in which case a camber change has no effect on cross.
PM
racing promotor
Moderator
More contact patch less RF camber increases turning force and has more effect on exit.
racing promotor
Moderator
If you were to do it with a RF camber change only you would decrease RF neg camber.
alvin l nunley
Site Supporter
1° camber, with a 6 1/2 inch spindle arm, raises the end of the arm .122 inches. Is that not significant?
I feel this also allows you to turn under someone off the corner. Do you give up a little roll speed yes but when my driver can cut through traffic and not have the kart getting crossed up it seems to work for us.
racing promotor
Moderator
LF camber would have more effect on entry
alvin l nunley
Site Supporter
I'm not assuming anything. It is as I stated. I have the CAD/CAM drawings to prove it.
Perpendicular to the ground at the center of the tire contact patch, (where it really matters), with near zero scub radius, how much does the chassis raise, or lower?
We've been over this several times. May need to find something else to bicker about.
Thanks!! So to continue, where do you feel like camber thrust comes into play?
Lol I don’t even know what camber thrust is? Please explain
racing promotor
Moderator
I would't worry about it, I like to keep things simple, I've never seen anywhere to fix a handling issue say adjust camber thrust, to me it's just a term smart guy's that race on paper talk about.
alvin l nunley
Site Supporter
That's what you're calling our discussions now, "bickering"!! That has, in my mind, a very negative connotation!!
alvin l nunley
Site Supporter
Overlay, showing 1° camber increase. I changed the point of the pivot for the angle, thus the difference in distance.
It’s basically where when you lean a tire (camber) it produces a force in the direction it’s leaning.
alvin l nunley
Site Supporter
Speaking of scrub radius, if my understanding of Wikipedia's description is correct, because of the relatively huge amounts of caster we use on karts, our tires do not pivot around that point on the ground that Wikipedia describes. Am I not seeing this clearly?
That point that Wikipedia describes as a tire rotation relationship is in front of the tire with only 12° caster, as in the picture. Wikipedia's illustration is with no caster.
That point that Wikipedia describes as a tire rotation relationship is in front of the tire with only 12° caster, as in the picture. Wikipedia's illustration is with no caster.
Regardless of how you read the definition, there are 2 things that are undeniable.
To steer, the spindle/ tire assembly must pivot around the kingpin axis.
To steer, the tire must change it's position on the ground. That position change must be relative to the contact patch to have any effect on the chassis.
If drawn in 3D, I think you will find that the position will change slightly in the fore/aft direction, but very little in the vertical direction.
A guy with 3D CAD skills and an abundance of free time would be able to map that out.
Here is the definition, copied directly from wikipedia.
The scrub radius is the distance in front view between the king pin axis and the center of the contact patch of the wheel, where both would theoretically touch the road. It could be positive, negative or zero.
Front view is where you are having your problem by adding third dimension to a two dimension definition.
Please explain how you can tell caster in a front view?
The scrub radius is the distance in front view between the king pin axis and the center of the contact patch of the wheel, where both would theoretically touch the road. It could be positive, negative or zero.
Front view is where you are having your problem by adding third dimension to a two dimension definition.
Please explain how you can tell caster in a front view?
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paulkish
old fart
Al you use the love emoji so often I thought i'd google on it.
How many of what I found below applies to you?
Or are you using love in some insulting way?
Love means saying goodbye to expectations.
Love doesn’t play the victim role or blame others.
Love includes letting go.
Love doesn’t require you to continue a relationship.
Love requires attention.
Love makes you feel good
Love has empathy
How many of what I found below applies to you?
Or are you using love in some insulting way?
Love means saying goodbye to expectations.
Love doesn’t play the victim role or blame others.
Love includes letting go.
Love doesn’t require you to continue a relationship.
Love requires attention.
Love makes you feel good
Love has empathy
SoCo Tire Treatments
Moderator
At track camber changes vary slightly, say going from 2.75 degrees to 2.5, or vice versa, most times just a turn of a flat or two. If you are making a 1 degree change in camber, you were never close to proper camber to begin with.