shoe clutches question

OVALTECH1 said:
I take it your got a clone running purple plate or under?
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Yes we have been running red plate some places require wiener some were open. I am going to put a green plate on it next time as the track we are running allows them in our class just wanted the kids to get used to running the red plate first. Crawl before you walk, walk before you run type deal.
 
we did a lot of playing with low speed air bleeds and so on to get ours from puffing and stalling. as well as getting the idle up to 2100/2200 also we used an NGK plug bkr5eix or stock #6341 its a 5 heat range and its a iridium fine wire that has really good no foul properties.
 
If possible get off that bronze bushing even if you have too go up one tooth.
Your actually supposed to soak it in hot oil so more can absorb into the impregnated bronze.
(advice is easily give :rolleyes: no I never did it just oiled or greased the darn thing)
I like the idea of a plug other then the 3910x
 
flattop1 said:
If possible get off that bronze bushing even if you have too go up one tooth.
Your actually supposed to soak it in hot oil so more can absorb into the impregnated bronze.
(advice is easily give :rolleyes: no I never did it just oiled or greased the darn thing)
I like the idea of a plug other then the 3910x
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I'm working on budget for bully single disc clutches right now. Hope my drivers aren't too rough on them(fingers crossed). Do you guys see much difference from red to green on the plugs not getting as sooty?
 
Bringing this back up to pick Brian's brain some more hopefully. Bought the bullys and it put a hurting on the other guys on starts, got us a couple wins. Bought a second kart with a Noram GE with light shoes in middle position inboard. Red springs still for 3k range full lock up?
 
racinnut15xm said:
Bringing this back up to pick Brian's brain some more hopefully. Bought the bullys and it put a hurting on the other guys on starts, got us a couple wins. Bought a second kart with a Noram GE with light shoes in middle position inboard. Red springs still for 3k range full lock up?
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Light shoes are 150 gms. Middle position is alright, but red springs will be a bit too strong -- that will lock up around 3800 (ie better for unrestricted.) I would suggest starting out with black springs (and maybe go softer yet for red plate.)
Don't be afraid to experiment -- the stop watch never lies.
We've got every spring imaginable for the Noram in stock if you need.
Glad you're happy with the Bully clutch. When you're in need of a rebuild, please keep us in mind.


-----
🏁Thanks and God bless,
Brian Carlson
Carlson Racing Engines
Vector Cutz
www.CarlsonMotorsports.com
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30 years of service to the karting industry
215 N. High St.
Linden, IN 47955
765-339-4407
bcarlson@CarlsonMotorsports.com
 
Never having raced 4 cycles, just 2 cycles, I developed my own understanding of the terms to be used. They seem to be a little different from what you guys are using to explain what is happening with the clutch. Even with that, I'm not sure everybody's using the same terms with 4 cycles. It's been my observation that sometimes people use different terms for the same thing and sometimes different things have the same terms to explain them. Engagement, stall, lockup are 3 examples. This is how I use the terms.
Engagement = when the shoes 1st come in contact with the drum.
Stall = when the clutch is slipping but holding the engine at a particular RPM. For instance; when you're in the pits and you're holding the brake to keep the axle from turning and the engine is being held at a particular RPM at full throttle.
Lockup = when the engine and the axle are turning the same RPM divided by the gear ratio.
In my experience, the transition from slipping to lock up, when you've got it right, should be very smooth, with little or no drop in RPM. I have a very vivid memory of the time when I 1st discovered this. Coming out of a corner, at a Sprint race, at full throttle, I noticed a distinct drop in RPM as the clutch locked up. I started opening the low-speed needle on my McCullough carburetor. Each lap, as I opened the low-speed needle just a little more, that drop in RPM became less and less and finally went away completely. I could almost see that little lightbulb going on over my head. Apparently I had discovered that the engine was going lean and that was causing the drop in RPM. That little trick apparently was instrumental in me winning all 3 heats, the 2nd of which was inverted at that time. It's an old story, but some things are just fundamental and don't change.
 
To confuse the terminology even more, Al...Noram (and other manufacturers) show engagement charts that are ridiculously low in rpm. This is what I call "chatter engagement." It's where the shoes first touch the drum and make some chattering noise (not engage/disengage chatter.) This is NOT where it will turn the tires (even with the kart on a stand.) These manufacturers' charts have unrealistically low "engagement" rpms for the applications that we are using the clutch in. They are commonplace in the chain saw industry though, where I suspect is the background of these folks and their method of charting engagement.
You are correct in the variance of folks definitions of many terms that we use in karting today. (ie the push, tight, understeer, locked down, stuck) thread discussion a while back.
I doubt that the words that we use will ever get really sorted out -- our language is always changing. We used terms like "cool" back in the day...today that might be equivalent to hot, rad, trick, wicked, and who knows what else from a different generation. :)
 
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