Slightest loose condition

Hey folks,
What are some of the ways to adjust for a small loose condition at apex only? We are just slightly stepping out about 20’ before apex and continues just past apex another 20’ maybe. It’s not a big step out but it is a slide.

Was considering moving my LR inward but figured I’d ask this question.
 
Hey folks,
What are some of the ways to adjust for a small loose condition at apex only? We are just slightly stepping out about 20’ before apex and continues just past apex another 20’ maybe. It’s not a big step out but it is a slide.

Was considering moving my LR inward but figured I’d ask this question.
Apex is usually a stagger adjustment. Here are a few questions to help understand where you're starting from:
What stagger are you running on the rear? You could reduce slightly
What air pressure spilt are you running on the rear tires? You could run a smaller or neutral split
What are your camber settings? Potentially increase LF camber
Is this condition consistent throughout the entire run?
 
Loose is fast, and on the edge of out of control.

Harry Hogg

(Days of Thunder)

If slight, leave alone.
Does the track get faster as the race goes on?
Does the condition get better? Or worse?

The more you try to dial in for a certain set of conditions, the further you will be off if those conditions change.

Kermit Buller
About 1992

Burris racer beat me to the other questions.

Follow his advice.
 
It’s definitely slight. We still beat the field by 1/2 lap. But the competition wasn’t there but they’ll be there in the 25th.

Caster 10/13
Rear hole LF and RF
Camber +0.5 and -2.5
Was on 1/2 pound psi split front and back.
1.5 Front and 1.25 rear stagger

It was consistent during hot laps, heat race and 20 lap feature. Which was done with various through variations track changes.
 
Loose is fast, and on the edge of out of control.

Harry Hogg

(Days of Thunder)

If slight, leave alone.
Does the track get faster as the race goes on?
Does the condition get better? Or worse?

The more you try to dial in for a certain set of conditions, the further you will be off if those conditions change.

Kermit Buller
About 1992

Burris racer beat me to the other questions.

Follow his advice.
Noted. All good points.

These lap times were 1/10th better than what we ran last year. But, our competitors were probably 2/10th better than last year.

We could possibly get more bite with a little more aggressive prep. But, I’d rather try a tweak to my setup.
 
Hey folks,
What are some of the ways to adjust for a small loose condition at apex only? We are just slightly stepping out about 20’ before apex and continues just past apex another 20’ maybe. It’s not a big step out but it is a slide.

Was considering moving my LR inward but figured I’d ask this question.
Before moving the LR I'd check other things plus confirm where LR hub is now, what is the distance from the inside edge of the wheel to the frame, what is the RR from the inside edge of the wheel to the frame, how many spacers are behind the LF wheel is there room to move it in,
what are your current camber settings.
 
Currently the LR is about a finger width off the rail. Last race it came loose and moved all the way out to the snap ring. I didn’t notice it until I was on the grid for the feature so I just eye balled it where it appeared to have been. Usually we are about 110 mm for the outer bearing edge to the surface the wheels mount to. The Right Rear is 115 bearing to wheel surface. (About a thumb width gap)

The lose condition I’m talking about was after the wheel was put back.

Caster 10/13
Rear hole LF and RF
Camber +0.5 and -2.5
Was on 1/2 pound psi split front and back.
1.5 Front and 1.25 rear stagger

There is room to move the LF. Maybe 1/8” spacer.
 
Currently the LR is about a finger width off the rail. Last race it came loose and moved all the way out to the snap ring. I didn’t notice it until I was on the grid for the feature so I just eye balled it where it appeared to have been. Usually we are about 110 mm for the outer bearing edge to the surface the wheels mount to. The Right Rear is 115 bearing to wheel surface. (About a thumb width gap)

The lose condition I’m talking about was after the wheel was put back.

Caster 10/13
Rear hole LF and RF
Camber +0.5 and -2.5
Was on 1/2 pound psi split front and back.
1.5 Front and 1.25 rear stagger

There is room to move the LF. Maybe 1/8” spacer.
Based on that info I'd move the RR hub in half that distance you currently have.
 
Before moving the LR I'd check other things plus confirm where LR hub is now, what is the distance from the inside edge of the wheel to the frame, what is the RR from the inside edge of the wheel to the frame, how many spacers are behind the LF wheel is there room to move it in,
what are your current camber settings.
Confirmed:
I have both a 1/8” spacer and a 1/4” spacer on the inside of each wheel hub.
 

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FWIW, I prefer to run both fronts and RR all the way in and leave them there (with very few exceptions) on modern karts. I do all my work (for the most part) with the LR to set rear tracking. Moving the fronts out amplifies the weight jacking effect of caster.
I wouldn't be afraid to lay the RF (camber) down even more if it's just stepping out on exit. Moving the LR hub "in" will help, as will increasing cross by a washer. I would make those adjustments in that order, only as needed, btw. I know some will agree, but it has sure helped when I've made these changes.
I appreciate that even though you are winning, you are still striving to get faster. That's the right (winner's) attitude in my opinion.


-----
🏁Thanks and God bless,
Brian Carlson
Carlson Racing Engines
Vector Cutz
www.CarlsonMotorsports.com
Carlson Motorsports on Facebook
www.youtube.com
34 years of service to the karting industry ~ 1Cor 9:24
Linden, IN
765-339-4407
bcarlson@CarlsonMotorsports.com
 
I appreciate that even though you are winning, you are still striving to get faster. That's the right (winner's) attitude in my opinion.
-----
🏁Thanks and God bless,
Brian Carlson
Carlson Racing Engines
Vector Cutz
www.CarlsonMotorsports.com
Carlson Motorsports on Facebook
www.youtube.com
34 years of service to the karting industry ~ 1Cor 9:24
Linden, IN
765-339-4407
bcarlson@CarlsonMotorsports.com
Come next week we’ll be facing the best in the MidWest. We gotta get better and let the big dogs push us past our current levels. Which is why we’re trying to fine tune some things.
 
Last edited:
Correction.
I didn’t remember correctly. Our RR is only 7mm off the rear rail.
Your killing us lol !! that's still a tick to far ya want it as close as you can having like 2mm clearance between squat of tire and the frame. get what you can get with the RR, move the LF as far in as possible try it, you say slight so that may be enough to stabilize it, also I just noticed you show your 1/2 lb split being front to rear, if that indeed is the case I'd change that 1/2 lb split left to right as well and test by taking out of the LR and adding to the RF could potentially make it a tick worse, if I found that to be the case I'd try straight up air same in all 4 tires and note my findings, if that fixed it I'd put the 1/2 lb split back in it and add 2 % of cross and see what I had.

Good Luck !!
 
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