Stagger changes on a banked track, illustrated.

alvin l nunley

Site Supporter
To illustrate how you "might" want to change your stagger numbers when racing on a banked track, I give you this. The inside diameter of the track is 64 feet. Nothing special about that number that's just the way it worked out. The track is 20 foot wide. In the middle of the corner I drew a 40 inch line to represent the outside diameter, tire to tire. I just decided on 40 inches so don't get on me on that. I then rotated that line 6 times, 10° each time. I then marked each side of the track at 12 inches from the wall, or edge. 2 dots represent the outside tire's edge in the turn. I then drew arcs, intersecting 3 dots, one on each side and one at the end of the 40 inch line I drew previously. I did this 6 times. You can read the numbers, it shows you how long each arc is. The arcs represent the theoretical line the outside rear tire will follow. The numbers you see measuring the arcs are in inches, because my software will not represent the things in feet. The arcs only cover 4 10° increments, plus the bottom line. If I made any mistakes I'm sure you let me know. LOL

64 foot dia banked turn.jpg72-2 foot dia banked turn.jpg
 
Like I said in the other thread, ill let my 20 years on dirt decide how much stagger to run, you do it your way
Less than one half my experience. And still, I feel like I am learning something new every day, and I'm proud of it. I am nothing if not determined.
 
Less than one half my experience. And still, I feel like I am learning something new every day, and I'm proud of it. I am nothing if not determined.
How much experience running bullrings on dirt? I mentioned dirt in my comment but you chose not to see it, my experience there trumps yours I'm guessing
 
I don't know the exact scientific words to explain it, but just looking at the drawing you can see, at least I can see, you may be seeing it differently, there are 2 forces working against the Kart instead of one. The bottom part of the illustration shows a force against the tire, and a resistance against the force. As long as they are equal, you maintain traction. If the force overcomes a resistance, of course you slide. In the top illustration, you can see 2 resistances against the force at work. One is the same as the bottom, the other is at an angle to the force. You're trying to push the kart up the hill. The forces the same, but the combination of resistances is greater. I can't explain this in real scientific terms so I hope you'll forgive me for that. Oh, and by the way, the kart is a inanimate object, it's incapable of knowing anything. LOL don't get mad, I'm just joking with you.

Untitled-5.jpg
 
It always boils back to we race on track, not on paper !!
testing prototypes for the chassis company we were sponsored/worked for, we used 3 axis accelerometers, when you see that information over several different types of tracks laid out in front of you it gives you an understanding of what is going on, flat track g forces are trying to turn you over, as banking increases those pressures move in ward trying to push you down in, until till a point when they are trying to roll under, thats why a math formula cant tell you perfect stagger, too many unknown variables
 
testing prototypes for the chassis company we were sponsored/worked for, we used 3 axis accelerometers, when you see that information over several different types of tracks laid out in front of you it gives you an understanding of what is going on, flat track g forces are trying to turn you over, as banking increases those pressures move in ward trying to push you down in, until till a point when they are trying to roll under, thats why a math formula cant tell you perfect stagger, too many unknown variables
That's also why on the same banked 1/8th mile bull ring track for a calcium high grip day race 8.8 sec laps VS normal night race 10.3 sec laps to keep good crisp rotation it requires 1/8" to 1/4" MORE rear stagger.
 
Al
I can see the outward and the upward .
This is 2 dimensional . There is also the donward force .
As stated 3 dimensions are involved .
 
Al
I can see the outward and the upward .
This is 2 dimensional . There is also the donward force .
As stated 3 dimensions are involved .
I'm pretty sure, not 100%, my picture shows the forces that are in play on a banked track. Perhaps you could explain to me what that 3rd force is, an illustration might help.
 
Back
Top