Toe question

Mod4712 said:
Sorry to highjack the thread. I just have so many questions running through my head all the time and I only know one person who has much knowledge on karts.
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There are also wheel base rules. Setting toe on the right allows you to fudge the wheel base rules a little.
A very little but as is often said on here everything matters.

If you set it on the left by turning the left tire to the left a little, then on the track straight the left wheel will turn to the right and move forward a little.
But if you set it on the right by turning the right tire to the right, then on the track operating the right side tire will slightly move forward when it splits the toe and the left tire will move back.
Though when measured with either side straight you will be within the rules, on the track it makes the wheel base on the left shorter and lengthens the right. ... huh? never did understand it ... :)

Also if indeed you do mainly use the big right front to make the kart go where you want to go then it puts the left front even farther behind the right front, further shortening the inside wheel base. You end up being able to run with the inside wheelbase less then what is allowed in the rules because when the left front turns left it also moves back. maybe?????
 
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paulkish said:
There are also wheel base rules. Setting toe on the right allows you to fudge the wheel base rules a little.
A very little but as is often said on here everything matters.

If you set it on the left by turning the left tire to the left a little, then on the track straight the left wheel will turn to the right and move forward a little.
But if you set it on the right by turning the right tire to the right, then on the track operating the right side tire will slightly move forward when it splits the toe and the left tire will move back.
Though when measured with either side straight you will be within the rules, on the track it makes the wheel base on the left shorter and lengthens the right. ... huh? never did understand it ... :)

Also if indeed you do mainly use the big right front to make the kart go where you want to go then it puts the left front even farther behind the right front, further shortening the inside wheel base. You end up being able to run with the inside wheelbase less then what is allowed in the rules because when the left front turns left it also moves back. maybe?????
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Makes sense to me. shouldn’t shortening the LS wheel base help the kart turn?
 
Yes.


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It's the real thing, not stagger, which causes a styrofoam cup to not roll straight. ... :)
The small end of a styrofoam cup has a shorter wheel base and how it rolls has nothing at all to do with stagger.



... where ya at Al ? ... :)

How bout puttin wheel base in yer spread sheet and smokin it? ... :)
I'll bet it makes it a lot easier for your numbers to work out.
It's not about stagger Al it's about how turning the wheel alters the wheel base given x amount of stagger 1" off the wall.

... just havin fun. butt hummmmm.... maybe?
 
paulkish said:
Yes.


=======================

It's the real thing, not stagger, which causes a styrofoam cup to not roll straight. ... :)
The small end of a styrofoam cup has a shorter wheel base and how it rolls has nothing at all to do with stagger.



... where ya at Al ? ... :)

How bout puttin wheel base in yer spread sheet and smokin it? ... :)
I'll bet it makes it a lot easier for your numbers to work out.
It's not about stagger Al it's about how turning the wheel alters the wheel base given x amount of stagger 1" off the wall.

... just havin fun. butt hummmmm.... maybe?
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How does a styrofoam cup have a wheel base at all?
 
Chipg56 said:
How does a styrofoam cup have a wheel base at all?
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hopin I sleep thru the night and am alive in the morning i'll try to give a 'wrong' explanation. ... with my first coffee

i'll hav to sleep on it

I think I can make a 'point' with it. ... :)
 
Now I won't sleep.

Waiting to see how you over complicate a styrofoam cup. Even without coffee in it.

Lmao
 
95 shaw said:
Now I won't sleep.

Waiting to see how you over complicate a styrofoam cup. Even without coffee in it.

Lmao
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LOL, my poor old mind just wandered to it right or wrong and diameter matters.
Heck this is the thought and it's quick.
Bigger diameter is going to have more surface on the table when it rolls and the small end will have less surface on the table when it rolls. All inbetween will vary proportionally. So... the large end with more surface rolls faster. It's got to ain't it? ... :)

Al always talks about how a tire that doesn't slip will roll better. So, more surface on the big end has to roll better and Al's right.

And I'm right too because then stagger can't have anything at all to do with the radius your going around. ... :)
 
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sidewaysagain said:
We got a Rival, we run a very short track. Straight away lengths are 190 feet long. How much toe out is suggested. Is there a base line set up, we can look at. We are going to scale our karts this weekend. Thanks
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Did you get your original question answered ok for you?

Racepromotor answered based on his experience and his knowledge of your particular chassis and I recommend taking his answer as correct.
But racing you need to try everything so i'll add try it the other way too and see if it makes a difference.
I think most line up the right side tires and then put toe in the left.
But there are reasons some would do it by putting the toe in the right for various reasons.
Myself personally it's you just need some how much just depends on what you think gets you around the track best.
I think the end answer is it's about what gets you the best on track performance and though everything matters what matters to you is what works best.
 
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Where you set to matters little when on the track. The tires will point where they need to, guided by the driver.
It will matter when setting weights on the scales. Because you set the toe lock at this time.
Regardless, to achieve the same numbers as manufacturers, you should use their method. Same thing for using anyone's setup, use their method.
Then be consistent to make your notes valid.

To test this, get on scales with the lock in and left tie rod loose. Read scales while adding toe out.
 
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paulkish said:
Al always talks about how a tire that doesn't slip will roll better. So, more surface on the big end has to roll better and Al's right.
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Having a senior moment? lol What I said was; a rolling tire grips better than a sliding tire. The whole reason for nonskid breaks!
 
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