Upcoming RUSH crate program into karting with mandatory Hoosier tires questions

paulkish

old fart
RUSH has stated they will mandate speck Hoosier tires, with NO prepping allowed. I know no prepping has been discussed in the past and I still have a few questions.

I think in the past allowing prepping over not allowing it has come down to it's too expensive via sending samples out, chain of command, etc., to prove a tire has been prepped. In light of that I'm thinking there may be several things which can be looked at and tested for at the track via minimal equipment purchase.

It would become look at tires in a specific way which all will pretty much understand and if several or all of the indicators show the possibility of prepping then the tire is deemed to be prepped. The racer would be DQ'ed and then have to prove the tire was not prepped. Maybe if DQ'ed the tire could be cut in half with the racer getting one half to use to prove it was not prepped and the track or RUSH official would get the other half.

Below i'm listing some possible questioning of a tire which maybe if all or a percentage show fail or tire prepping a DQ would follow. We trust the judgement of tech inspectors using tech tools to DQ an engine and I see no reason the same could not apply to tires.

Question 1:
Is having a minimum durometer reading enough to show it's likely tires have been prepped?

Question 2:
Is there a meter or sorts available to read for chemical prepping available? If there is would it show it's likely tires have been prepped?

Question 3:
Is visual inspection enough to show it's likely tires have been prepped?

Question 4:
If a chart was developed showing normal spring rates of each speck tire at maybe a few given air pressures and the tire did not fall into the chart correctly be a way to show it's likely tires have been prepped?

I'm thinking if you fail all of the 4 above it would become accepted by racers who ever was being tested was prepping their tires.

I added in the spring rate test for tire prepping not remembering ever hearing thoughts on it before.

I have a final question which might be an additional deterrent to racers using prep on their tires. The question is I think currently samples are taken to be sent out to a lab to be tested for chemicals which would indicate prepping. Is there an easy quick test maybe taken from the inside of a tire, something like put the sample in the jar, shake it up and see if it foams or changes color to indicate a tire may have been prepped? If there is or are some easy quick potential identifiers there use could be the 5 thing which could be done. It would be a do a cheap test first to see if it's worth sending out tire samples to be expensively tested.

It might be something as simple as the acidity or alkaline reading from the inside of the tire. Might all or most all new or un prepped tires be below or above a specific acidity? Sure it would mean there would be things you might use to mount tires which would cause them to fail testing but it would be up to the racer to make sure they did not use those mounting helpers. It would be no different then running your alcohol engine on gas after racing and then the next time out fail a fuel test.

I think that x number of easy inexpensive tests are possible where it would become understood that if you failed all of them or a certain number of them you would be DQ'ed and it would become accepted by other racers because of the tests failed you were prepping.

It might be as easy as before being allowed to enter a RUSH race the racer would be required to sign stating they are aware of the type of tire testing and it's possible short comes but agree to it and it's outcome.
 
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Might the above be able to lead to tracks if they choose to prevent prepping purchasing a durometer, a chemical meter and a sprint tester and stop the prepping in a way which would be accepted by racers. The racers may not like it the same as those who fail a fuel test don't like it and argue against it, but it would be accepted by everyone else as "that's the way it is, we know you didn't do it but don't ever do it again".
 
The durometer test seems like it might be feasible. Certainly someone could shoot holes in it . As well as any other method .
Hope they have a plan in place . Scouts Honor will be the key too success.
With the prepers having to be run off . Its been years since wka tried it , maybe things have changed in the testing realm .
 
I'm kinda thinking of dreaming of a possible tech scenario where in the tech barn instead of tearing down the engine, they duro tires, then maybe spring test tires followed by the tech man popping tires off the rim and using a sniffer inside. Those three things plus the tech mans experienced feel about things would either say there ok or toss the racer with a DQ. Give the DQ'ed half of each tire back to send out to do their own proof of chain of custody etc. for their own testing to argue against the track or RUSH. I'd say getting only half a tire back if you fail and don't accept the DQ would be good enough to keep most away from prepping. ... :)

Make it not worth their wile to complain and moan about the process. ... :)
 
I haven't seen any announcement that an experienced tech man is going to be at every race that Rush competes in. An inexperienced biased tech could have a field day. Sounds like the best bet would be to stay away from the series.
 
What you proposed is reasonable for a no prep series .
Judgement calls lead to issue's . Even with collaborating evidence .
It boils down to follow the rules or don't race the series.
 
What you proposed is reasonable for a no prep series .
Judgement calls lead to issue's . Even with collaborating evidence .
It boils down to follow the rules or don't race the series.

Like most racing it can become follow as close to the rules as you can yet still have an advantage which will not be very likely to get found out/caught.
 
I can easily change the spring rate with no prep, been doing it for years with Vegas.

I'm thinking your would go to the tech barn and remove your tires for testing.

They would then be put under vacuum and filed with nitrogen to a specified pressure and the chart would give you an expected spring rate per rim width. I think all the speck non prepped tires would be very close if not exactly the same when tested that way. Would prepped tires fall out of the chart guide lines is yet to be seen and not known at this point. RUSH would have to buy some tires or be given some tires to test which could be returned and sold, to come up with the chart.

Heck this might even work with their speck non prepped car tires. If they do experiment with it it would give a lot of good will towards RUSH. Maybe hoosier would develop a chart after testing to promote their tires?

I think today I offered a new idea to possibly get rid of prep. The idea I think is new but is it a good idea and would it work, I don't know. It's new!
 
Or tires being cut,profiled,finished,not a good idea sending inexperienced drivers out on a track with a tire with no bite,karts that don’t handle will result in a lot of wrecks
 
The series has their rules posted on the Rush Karting Series Facebook page. Anyone considering the series should definitely read them. Just a couple of the many different things: no tachs or temperature gauges, front bumpers have to be can not extend wider then inside the front tires, quick release steering wheels recommended for flat karts, no carbon fiber allowed (I'd have to think helmets would be included), rear axle ends must have snap rings and be safety wired. I'm curious as to what experienced karters think of them.
 
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DThank you I just skimmed through the rules.

In total with no minimum kart count and lots of tracks it's a great opportunity for mommy and daddy to buy their kid a trophy and first place via track selection and attendance. My guess is with the amount of tracks on board there will be a lot of places to be the only kart in the class doing hot laps for the bought accolades. Might even lead to mommy and daddy buying little johnny or sussie a Western PA rookie of the year award. ... :)

I'd also guess there will be kids of well known car racers in the series just for the accolades and to put a first place kiddy or kid rating onto their future racing notes. As with all RUSH series it appears to be something again marketed to a nytch wealth group. The last was touted as for $15,000 you can go sprint car racing. My guess is there thinking entry to this is being sold to a large group of prospective customers from new and old karting ranks who can shell out $5000.

Why tracks don't charge the heck out of them to provide a place for their customers to use the unique equipment they mandate, i'll never know. Without the tracks they have nothing and tracks seem to let them have the places to race without much cost.

Racers and Tracks. Don't forget their customers are you the racers and track owners. Selling to the racers is one thing but they should be the customers of tracks, not the reverse.

Tracks if you don't get at least $20 for each RUSH kart using your track, your cheating yourself.
 
The series has their rules posted on the Rush Karting Series Facebook page. Anyone considering the series should definitely read them. Just a couple of the many different things: no tachs or temperature gauges, front bumpers have to be can not extend wider then inside the front tires, quick release steering wheels recommended for flat karts, no carbon fiber allowed (I'd have to think helmets would be included), rear axle ends must have snap rings and be safety wired. I'm curious as to what experienced karters think of them.
Seems like there mixing flat and caged karts running together on track in same race ( hope I'm wrong ), MANY $500 fine violations just backs up thought's above it's a marketing plan to fill a few pockets. As for the rules it proves there not about safety and there CLUELESS when it comes to Karting.
 
Racing promotor:

You really should attend the meeting Sunday. I think you will be surprised at how professionally it's run.

At this point not knowing how and if it will effect 'regular' karting classes, i'm not anti RUSH karting. My thoughts about how joe racer with kids will respond is just that only my thoughts.

Who's going to be pushed out of karting because they can't afford the demanded entry money is what bothers the heck out of me.
 
Racing promotor:

You really should attend the meeting Sunday. I think you will be surprised at how professionally it's run.

At this point not knowing how and if it will effect 'regular' karting classes, i'm not anti RUSH karting. My thoughts about how joe racer with kids will respond is just that only my thoughts.

Who's going to be pushed out of karting because they can't afford the demanded entry money is what bothers the heck out of me.
I would have NO doubt it's professionally run, but keep in mind put an I in run what do you have " RUIN " , the I part is it's all about the $$$$$$$$$,
When I see mixing cage and flat classes together I picture a kid with a broken neck, and Quick release steering wheels HIGHLY recommended for flat karts where the driver is not secured by a harness, I don't have to tell you what I picture there and it's not good, plus now whomever came up with these rules are either going to be or instructing whomever how to safety check karts for everyone Ya right, plus I agree with your reservations, I wouldn't participate with this deal as a track or a racer I don't care how much they payed me, Those reasons are why I say CLUELESS !!
 
I dont believe they are mixing flat and champ. It says the tracks can choose wether their class will be a champ class or flat class. Only $500 to protest someones engine, that's a good deal lol. Can't forget there recommendation to buy new wheels so you dont get nailed for prepping tires.
 
I dont believe they are mixing flat and champ. It says the tracks can choose wether their class will be a champ class or flat class. Only $500 to protest someones engine, that's a good deal lol. Can't forget there recommendation to buy new wheels so you dont get nailed for prepping tires.
I was hoping I was wrong about mixing them.
 
I dont believe they are mixing flat and champ. It says the tracks can choose wether their class will be a champ class or flat class. Only $500 to protest someones engine, that's a good deal lol. Can't forget there recommendation to buy new wheels so you dont get nailed for prepping tires.

Why would you have to protest anyone's engine? It's a sealed RUSH deal and they need to police it themselves.

Flat and champ together? Doesn't that instantly double the amount of classes there either adding, taking over or pushing out of regular kart classes.

The future they seem to be planning for karting is if you can't afford $5000+ to go kart racing you shouldn't be racing karts and we don't need you because your too poor and don't fit into our marketing group.

Common on now you mean Slippery Rock's going to add 8 classes in 2021?

I think not and it's going to be about pushing poor low funded racers out grabbing as many as they can from those already racing.

Their future is if you ain't got a pot to pee in you ain't got no kart to sit in.

Hobby? tinker with your own stuff? That's out too.
 
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