Valve guide options

Thomas1971

Member
Hey everyone. I have the Briggs valve guide installation tools for the Factory Briggs replacement valve guides. I would like to run longer,better valve guides than the Briggs ones, are there any aftermarket guides that will work with the Briggs reamers? Or are there any other valve guide install kits I can buy? EZ Bore used to make one but I can't find it on there website any more,just the replacement reamer and guides...
 
I know about cutting the seats for the valves, I have the cutting tool. I have the Briggs reamers to install Briggs shorter guides like I said. I was just wondering if there are any longer 1.25" guides for the Briggs reamers. I think there OD is 0.283? But I need to measure them to make sure.
 
EZ Bore still shows the guides but .314 OD. Length 1.25 and 1.5
I don't think the reamer will be a deciding factor.
I always tho't the B/S reamer was too loose and bought undersized reamers.
 
CV Products used to make the stock OD guides in .750, 1.0, 1.25, and 1.5"lengths, as well as the same lengths in a +.002" OD for use with the stock tooling. We used to buy them 100 pieces per size.

And they had .310, .311, .312, .314, .315, .316 OD also, and two different OD for the thicker exhaust guide in varying lengths.

To have over 1,000 guides in stock was normal.

Today, you will be hard pressed to find guides easily. They are out there, you just have to look for them.
 
IMHO,, send the block to Brian Carlson have the EZ Bore guides installed,, new OS seats installed with Locktite Quick metal,, Buy the new trued valves from Brian,, it will be finished with a torque plate. He will give you the torque specs and pattern. You'll get a Pro Job and can go back to sleep knowing it's the best it can be. If I was building a FH today and didn't have the tools I have that's exactly what I'd do.
On second thought,,, have him hone it for a new piston while you're at it. An extensive valve job like described will affect the cylinder too.
My 2 cents,, WP
 
CV Products used to make the stock OD guides in .750, 1.0, 1.25, and 1.5"lengths, as well as the same lengths in a +.002" OD for use with the stock tooling. We used to buy them 100 pieces per size.

And they had .310, .311, .312, .314, .315, .316 OD also, and two different OD for the thicker exhaust guide in varying lengths.

To have over 1,000 guides in stock was normal.

Today, you will be hard pressed to find guides easily. They are out there, you just have to look for them.
Thanks for the info. Are the stock guides OD 0.283? I found some that are 1.25" in length. Can I just measure the OD of a Briggs replacement guide to find out the size?
 
IMHO,, send the block to Brian Carlson have the EZ Bore guides installed,, new OS seats installed with Locktite Quick metal,, Buy the new trued valves from Brian,, it will be finished with a torque plate. He will give you the torque specs and pattern. You'll get a Pro Job and can go back to sleep knowing it's the best it can be. If I was building a FH today and didn't have the tools I have that's exactly what I'd do.
On second thought,,, have him hone it for a new piston while you're at it. An extensive valve job like described will affect the cylinder too.
My 2 cents,, WP


I am humbled....and agree with everything you just wrote.

Thomas1971,
We have plenty of aftermarket "quality" guides in stock, various lengths and ODs.
The stock guides come in a variety of OD's. I have those (and all the part numbers for them) in stock if you want to use them...but, do NOT use the Briggs reamer, you will be very disappointed, it is .250" and the valves mostly measure .246" - .247" -- that may be fine on a rototiller build, but is not tight enough for a competitive race engine running 0W oil.
If there is anything that we can help you with, please feel free to give us a call at the shop.


-----
🏁Thanks and God bless,
Brian Carlson
Carlson Racing Engines
Vector Cutz
www.CarlsonMotorsports.com
Carlson Motorsports on Facebook
31 years of service to the karting industry
Linden, IN
765-339-4407
bcarlson@CarlsonMotorsports.com
 
You finish the valve guides with a small 1/4 inch flex hone right? Like the EZ Bore kit? Not a reamer like the Briggs kit.
I was going to do it like the EZ bore kit, But with the Briggs size valve guides (.283”OD). Use the Briggs .283” reamer, press in the valve guide, then hone it to finish.
I’m planning on only doing the intake valve, the exhaust has a steel guide.
 
I use a .240" to .250" mandrel on my Sunnen hone, and size it perfectly. Especially nice when using the full length guides.

I also have every reamer in .005" increments from .243" to .250"......took over 30 years to acquire all those.

And I probably have 10 different sizes of stepped reamers for the counter bore and an equal amount of cones and stepped indexes for various seat sizes and reamer shafts.

That alone shows you the commitment needed to do just guides.

Most of that stuff has not been used since the Animal took over, and then the Clone.

Guys like Brian and some of these diehards down South should be commended for still offering their services.

I really need to research what guides are available, as I miss the days of walking over to the bin and grabbing whatever size I needed. The current Distributor I work for probably doesn't have a dozen guides total in inventory for the Flathead, but we have 100 of each for the Animal and Clone.

You should look at getting a .248 reamer from MSC or Mcmaster-Carr and ream your guide before you flex hone it to finish.

Another tip, is have two cones. One for your counter bore, and then a second one for your finish reamer. Press a new guide into your reamer cone and finish it to size of reamer shaft to decrease chance of misalignment during finish reaming.
 
I use a .240" to .250" mandrel on my Sunnen hone, and size it perfectly. Especially nice when using the full length guides.

I also have every reamer in .005" increments from .243" to .250"......took over 30 years to acquire all those.

And I probably have 10 different sizes of stepped reamers for the counter bore and an equal amount of cones and stepped indexes for various seat sizes and reamer shafts.

That alone shows you the commitment needed to do just guides.

Most of that stuff has not been used since the Animal took over, and then the Clone.

Guys like Brian and some of these diehards down South should be commended for still offering their services.

I really need to research what guides are available, as I miss the days of walking over to the bin and grabbing whatever size I needed. The current Distributor I work for probably doesn't have a dozen guides total in inventory for the Flathead, but we have 100 of each for the Animal and Clone.

You should look at getting a .248 reamer from MSC or Mcmaster-Carr and ream your guide before you flex hone it to finish.

Another tip, is have two cones. One for your counter bore, and then a second one for your finish reamer. Press a new guide into your reamer cone and finish it to size of reamer shaft to decrease chance of misalignment during finish reaming.
Thanks for the info. I found the reamers on MSC and I’m going to order them. 0.2475”and 0.2485”. And a 0.250” hone from ez bore. And I found some 1.25” length guides, the right OD 0.283”.
Having 2 cones is a great idea.
 
Find yourself a .247" & .248" reamer now. The current valves are all coming a bit undersized (.246" - .247" stems.) If you are building a race engine, you want to run those guides as tight as you possibly can without failure. Ream .001" over the stem size with your straight flute reamer and plenty of coolant, then finish hone to the clearance that you want to use.
The Briggs finish reamers are pretty much useless. (ie oversized already - that was the point I was trying to make in my previous post about their tool kit.) If I remember correctly, their seat centering cone was only available in the OD counterbore size, so you won't be able to use that for your id finishing either.
Mike is exactly right, in that you will want to make up several seat centering cones for the shank size of your reamers.
Another thing you can do is turn the ends of your counterbore reamers down to .2475" for the first 1" and use that as a pilot to help center the reamer in the old guide (if it's not worn too badly. Stabilize the top of the reamer in a cone to center it in the seat (like the EZ Bore kit.) Drill slow and steady with straight flute reamers and you'll do fine.
 
Find yourself a .247" & .248" reamer now. The current valves are all coming a bit undersized (.246" - .247" stems.) If you are building a race engine, you want to run those guides as tight as you possibly can without failure. Ream .001" over the stem size with your straight flute reamer and plenty of coolant, then finish hone to the clearance that you want to use.
The Briggs finish reamers are pretty much useless. (ie oversized already - that was the point I was trying to make in my previous post about their tool kit.) If I remember correctly, their seat centering cone was only available in the OD counterbore size, so you won't be able to use that for your id finishing either.
Mike is exactly right, in that you will want to make up several seat centering cones for the shank size of your reamers.
Another thing you can do is turn the ends of your counterbore reamers down to .2475" for the first 1" and use that as a pilot to help center the reamer in the old guide (if it's not worn too badly. Stabilize the top of the reamer in a cone to center it in the seat (like the EZ Bore kit.) Drill slow and steady with straight flute reamers and you'll do fine.
Thanks, I measured my valves and they are a bit under sized. (There new valves). I’m going to order a couple more cones to fit them to the reamers.
 
I got a question on the steel valve guide in the exhaust side. I’ve read “building a flathead- by Jimmy Glenn” and he talked about reaming out the steel guide and installing a bronze guide. Does he mean to put a bronze guide in the steel guide? Or reaming the steel one until it’s out, then installing a bronze guide?
 
You can do either, but I prefer to install the new guide inside of the old steel guide on the exhaust side. Won't hurt a thing, but they are a bugger (tough) to ream through if you're going to do it by hand. I do it on the mill and I can still feel the difference.
The steel guide is .380" minimum od...If you pull it out (or ream it out) make sure that you can find a new guide that thick to replace it. Some of the older blocks are very thin in that area. I've got a national winning block here in the shop that the steel guide is loose in...sent it to a couple of other reputable builders who I trust and who have been around as long as I have, and none could fix it either. There is an answer for how to fix it, but it's a risk and it's not my highest priority right now. :)
 
You can do either, but I prefer to install the new guide inside of the old steel guide on the exhaust side. Won't hurt a thing, but they are a bugger (tough) to ream through if you're going to do it by hand. I do it on the mill and I can still feel the difference.
The steel guide is .380" minimum od...If you pull it out (or ream it out) make sure that you can find a new guide that thick to replace it. Some of the older blocks are very thin in that area. I've got a national winning block here in the shop that the steel guide is loose in...sent it to a couple of other reputable builders who I trust and who have been around as long as I have, and none could fix it either. There is an answer for how to fix it, but it's a risk and it's not my highest priority right now. :)
Hey Brian, Depending on how loose that steel guide is I have had some success using Seal Lock Fluid Weld from Goodsons https://goodson.com/products/fluid-weld?variant=33471463174 I used it every time I replaced guides and seats, great product. Another thought would be to pull the steel guide, knurl the block and press the guide back in. -- Chuck
 
Hey Brian, Depending on how loose that steel guide is I have had some success using Seal Lock Fluid Weld from Goodsons https://goodson.com/products/fluid-weld?variant=33471463174 I used it every time I replaced guides and seats, great product. Another thought would be to pull the steel guide, knurl the block and press the guide back in. -- Chuck

I haven't tried knurling the block, but the old steel guide was already knurled (od.) and red Loctited. I considered using the fluid weld, but I'm concerned it's too large of a gap to fill with the heat involved. The other concern is if I machine a new oversized guide/plug for it, the area around the guide is already so paper thin and brittle that if it breaks out when pressing the new guide in, it's all she wrote for that block. Welding is not an option for it to remain a stock legal block.
Thanks for the ideas though! It is much appreciated.
 
Back
Top