WAKE UPTrack Promotors

[ohv60racr]

ive always thought the same thing when I see engine builders stickers all the 206's!

That's because they do the couple of things that Briggs does not do at the factory like check coil gap , float setting in the carb , make sure intake alignment has as little obstruction as possible and they will dyno break it in , I have a 206 , a clone and a flat all done by the same builder , if tracks would support it , I would support it and sell the clone and flathead ! I like how people bash the 206 and have no clue to what a stout motor it really is ! It will smoke a flat head sticker at half the price and last 3 seasons easy if you keep the dirt out of it ! And I know from experience , so dont bash me with BS comments !

 

[payneracing714]

That's because they do the couple of things that Briggs does not do at the factory like check coil gap , float setting in the carb , make sure intake alignment has as little obstruction as possible and they will dyno break it in , I have a 206 , a clone and a flat all done by the same builder , if tracks would support it , I would support it and sell the clone and flathead ! I like how people bash the 206 and have no clue to what a stout motor it really is ! It will smoke a flat head sticker at half the price and last 3 seasons easy if you keep the dirt out of it ! And I know from experience , so dont bash me with BS comments !

Didn't think that was a bs comment, I was under the impression you get motor from briggs and it was ready to go! Thanks for the info

 

["J'-remy]

I hear all this complaining with the predator everyone is cheating the motors in those classes, when it comes right down to it I don't think it's happening near as much as guy's think, and even if it is there not very good at it, and it's not helping there performance and in some cases what they think helps actually hurts. And now I'll tell you why a guy racing out of Paul's trailer last year decided to try predator we knew for a fact the motor was literally taken out of the box bolted on and raced, in fact without even venting the cap first few runs of course motor cut out, however we observed if we could keep the motor running he was the fastest kart on the track, so we realized crap we didn't vent the cap so we drilled it and boom right to the front, might have raced predator 8 times won like half of them and if not for missing his marks a few laps would have won even more, so i know 100 % you can take a predator motor right out of the box and win. plus he was giving up weight in both classes. Of course it really helped this guy that we were pretty good with set up, tires, gearing, my point being without our help he would of ran mid pack and after 4 to 6 races would of been one of the guy's complaining the front runners were cheating up the motors. Are guy's tinkering breaking the rule by spirit of intent of course some are but that can be policed with rules in place that allow to do so, use the rules more and send a message instead of trying to do away with the predator motor, as there the biggest classes at all 3 of our local tracks add up all predator classes together and there's nights where there over 50 % of total entries for the track, police it better and let well enough alone. JM2cents but in the end all another motor option will do is thin the predator fields some, add yet more classes to the line ups, end up not taking off around here like the LO 206 is never going to.
Now if AKRA wants to get on board and create a true AMATURE clone class as the official starter class, take your concept and run with it.

this is not the case in the Carolinas. I have talked to nearly 7 or 8 National level engine builders. the price is around $800 from therm or $150 at the track. I have also talked to drivers in that area that have all, and I mean ALL told me if it ain't a built you won't be competitive. a stock predator should be near 4600 on the tach why is the rpm rule 5500 all over the Carolinas? they told me what is done. twist the cam. move the cam timing gear on the crank. rework the carb. do some voodoo to the rings and im sure a whole host of things. Possum Kingdom made a block to place in-between the fins of the cylinder/head to easily check a milled head so they could throw those guys out without having to tear motors apart. LOL. it might not be a problem in your area but down here IT IS. this is why I bought a clone. to me its the skill on the track not the BS behind closed doors.

 

[payneracing714]

i will say, at a certain track it seems like the predators sound more and more like a clone each week on the track. just saying but what do i know, I guess my hearing could be getting bad or something

 

[DynoDon]

As for twisting the cam, that can be easily identified from the 15 or so profiles I have in my records. They are all and I mean all really close to each other. I could actually do a profile on it if I wanted. Any cam shaft that profiles even close to a pro clone cam should not be in a predator. As for the gear on the crank being turned, they are all over the place. If I were to do a profile on the cam, I would have to do it in a fashion that identifies/relates to the centerline. So if a crank had a 106 centerline the cam profile would be different from the one that I would design for a 108,110,112,114, and yes even a 116. Still none of them would be close to a pro clone cam.
Even though I check the gap between the block and the head, doesn’t mean the head hasn’t been off and a few thousands shaved off or the valves dropped in the seats. I also have the specs on that item. It wouldn’t be hard to design a rules package for this engine but good by clone and hello $1200 predator

 

[XXX#40]

Keep deleting my posts Don so you can push your agenda, the predator is fine, its doesnt need your rules.
Tracks that have kept it out of the box with NO changes are doing great, out of the box, stock muffler, intake/air filter and the gov. in place and working.
Once racers figure out, anyone associated with AKRA doesnt want the predator to do well, the better off it will be.
Add the things that your local racers want, who cares you cant take your engine and race all over, thats the problem in the first place.
Keep a $120.00 claim, and the track can swap you engines any time they see fit.

 

[jaymancds]

this is not the case in the Carolinas. I have talked to nearly 7 or 8 National level engine builders. the price is around $800 from therm or $150 at the track. I have also talked to drivers in that area that have all, and I mean ALL told me if it ain't a built you won't be competitive. a stock predator should be near 4600 on the tach why is the rpm rule 5500 all over the Carolinas? they told me what is done. twist the cam. move the cam timing gear on the crank. rework the carb. do some voodoo to the rings and im sure a whole host of things. Possum Kingdom made a block to place in-between the fins of the cylinder/head to easily check a milled head so they could throw those guys out without having to tear motors apart. LOL. it might not be a problem in your area but down here IT IS. this is why I bought a clone. to me its the skill on the track not the BS behind closed doors.

I turned mine 5600 with a stock cam, stock timing, stock head, etc. Only thing changed is the springs, exhaust, jets, and the k&n filter.

I don't know who you talked to, but I have a hard time believing it isn't monkey-see, monkey-do. I have a feeling these "gotta be built" guys are the same ones who think you have to have a new set of tires every time you hit the track.

Keep deleting my posts Don so you can push your agenda, the predator is fine, its doesnt need your rules.
Tracks that have kept it out of the box with NO changes are doing great, out of the box, stock muffler, intake/air filter and the gov. in place and working.
Once racers figure out, anyone associated with AKRA doesnt want the predator to do well, the better off it will be.
Add the things that your local racers want, who cares you cant take your engine and race all over, thats the problem in the first place.
Keep a $120.00 claim, and the track can swap you engines any time they see fit.

There is no sanctioning body that wants the predator to do well. If they did they would get on board with it. As with many sports, the rules organizers like the way it "used to be" when not everybody could show up and race. Like it or not, the predator is probably the best thing to happen to oval karting in 5 years. Anybody, theoretically on any chassis, can race, for cheap. Why else would your biggest classes be predators?

 

[XXX#40]

There is no sanctioning body that wants the predator to do well. If they did they would get on board with it. As with many sports, the rules organizers like the way it "used to be" when not everybody could show up and race. Like it or not, the predator is probably the best thing to happen to oval karting in 5 years. Anybody, theoretically on any chassis, can race, for cheap. Why else would your biggest classes be predators?

Yeah, I was in the first group that was racing the clone in the beginning(theres a picture here somewhere), we were laughed at and called all kinds of things, look what happen to it.
The predator will suffer the same path if TRACK OWNERS not promoters dont set their foot down, make the penalty stiff for being caught cheating, and keep it stock just like it came out of the box with 1 exception low oil sensor and thats it, if you want anything more there are plenty of other classes that allow it.
And no mixing, it has to be a harbor freight predator.

 

[jaymancds]

Yeah, I was in the first group that was racing the clone in the beginning(theres a picture here somewhere), we were laughed at and called all kinds of things, look what happen to it.
The predator will suffer the same path if TRACK OWNERS not promoters dont set their foot down, make the penalty stiff for being caught cheating, and keep it stock just like it came out of the box with 1 exception low oil sensor and thats it, if you want anything more there are plenty of other classes that allow it.
And no mixing, it has to be a harbor freight predator.

I agree. Locally the rules allow us to make them breathe a little better, so we do. Out of the box, governor/low oil removal is where I would like to see it. Keep it a true stock class. It will make the racing even closer than it is now, which I think is great. Close racing forces mistakes, which creates passes. A race where you can pass, and you pay for your mistakes, sounds like a fun race to me.

 

["J'-remy]

I turned mine 5600 with a stock cam, stock timing, stock head, etc. Only thing changed is the springs, exhaust, jets, and the k&n filter.

I don't know who you talked to, but I have a hard time believing it isn't monkey-see, monkey-do. I have a feeling these "gotta be built" guys are the same ones who think you have to have a new set of tires every time you hit the track.


There is no sanctioning body that wants the predator to do well. If they did they would get on board with it. As with many sports, the rules organizers like the way it "used to be" when not everybody could show up and race. Like it or not, the predator is probably the best thing to happen to oval karting in 5 years. Anybody, theoretically on any chassis, can race, for cheap. Why else would your biggest classes be predators?

??? says the guy running a modified predator. here we race strictly OUT OF THE BOX from HARBOR FREIGHT 5000 rpm the only thing to do is bolt on a chain guard and a throttle device, drill the gas cap. and go racing. pipes, springs top plates filters Sorry but your not running the same motor. and for me this is the problem as your motor rules are different than mine.

 

[XXX#40]

I agree. Locally the rules allow us to make them breathe a little better, so we do. Out of the box, governor/low oil removal is where I would like to see it. Keep it a true stock class. It will make the racing even closer than it is now, which I think is great. Close racing forces mistakes, which creates passes. A race where you can pass, and you pay for your mistakes, sounds like a fun race to me.

you allow 1 thing you'll allow more, keep it stock out of box, more power equals more stress on other parts.

 

[XXX#40]

??? says the guy running a modified predator. here we race strictly OUT OF THE BOX from HARBOR FREIGHT 5000 rpm the only thing to do is bolt on a chain guard and a throttle device, drill the gas cap. and go racing. pipes, springs top plates filters Sorry but your not running the same motor. and for me this is the problem as your motor rules are different than mine.

and this^^^^ is the way it should be

 

[XXX#40]

??? says the guy running a modified predator. here we race strictly OUT OF THE BOX from HARBOR FREIGHT 5000 rpm the only thing to do is bolt on a chain guard and a throttle device, drill the gas cap. and go racing. pipes, springs top plates filters Sorry but your not running the same motor. and for me this is the problem as your motor rules are different than mine.

As they should be different, if what they are doing is working then run with it, but Ive seen this movie before and know how it ends, you allow 1 mod, then they'll want another and so on.
Who cares if the track an hour away rules are different, if I really want to go race there buy another Predator

 

[jaymancds]

??? says the guy running a modified predator. here we race strictly OUT OF THE BOX from HARBOR FREIGHT 5000 rpm the only thing to do is bolt on a chain guard and a throttle device, drill the gas cap. and go racing. pipes, springs top plates filters Sorry but your not running the same motor. and for me this is the problem as your motor rules are different than mine.

I was just pointing out that you dont have to twist cams, or anything like that to turn the higher RPMs. Not trying to compare what I do to a stock motor.

 

[Ted Hamilton]

What part of BOX STOCK is so hard to understand? Want to play? Want to optimize? Want to garage engineer? GO FIND A DIFFERENT CLASS!!! The point isn't ease of use or optimazation, it is BOX STOCK TAKE THE ENGINE OUT OF THE EQUATION. I'd make the claim $25 and engine trade. And I'd make it track option to swap out a clutch with a $40 Comet also. Don't even remove the low oil sensor, just unplug or clip wire.

 

[jaymancds]

What part of BOX STOCK is so hard to understand? Want to play? Want to optimize? Want to garage engineer? GO FIND A DIFFERENT CLASS!!! The point isn't ease of use or optimazation, it is BOX STOCK TAKE THE ENGINE OUT OF THE EQUATION. I'd make the claim $25 and engine trade. And I'd make it track option to swap out a clutch with a $40 Comet also. Don't even remove the low oil sensor, just unplug or clip wire.

Like I said early in this thread, I HATE anything involved with swapping anything. I don't want anything that I don't know the history of. Engine, clutch, anything. Box stock is fine with me, but forget all this crazy swapping crap.

 

[XXX#40]

Like I said early in this thread, I HATE anything involved with swapping anything. I don't want anything that I don't know the history of. Engine, clutch, anything. Box stock is fine with me, but forget all this crazy swapping crap.

The track has the right to take your engine, and hand you another new in the box? nothing wrong with that
You deny this swap or a claim you are banned from the class for 1 year, not a season ,1 year
The claimed engine will be inspected before claim goes through, if its found illegal, or that someone blatantly done something to modify it in any way, the same ban is in effect.
Banned racers names on a board for all to see

 

[jaymancds]

The track has the right to take your engine, and hand you another new in the box? nothing wrong with that
You deny this swap or a claim you are banned from the class for 1 year, not a season ,1 year
The claimed engine will be inspected before claim goes through, if its found illegal, or that someone blatantly done something to modify it in any way, the same ban is in effect.
Banned racers names on a board for all to see

This is fine by me, I interpreted the previous post as swapping with another racer.

 

[XXX#40]

So yeah, like I said, been here before

 

[OVALTECH1]

I thought that was the ol’ greyhound but it was missing a rocker cover bolt. What year was that Jamie ?