What do you guys ask for cutting wise?

CarterTalley

CarterTalley

Member
I've got a 2 sets of tires cut by both Payne Speedshop (knox area) and FBR in Newport TN. I liked both sets, but felt like both were super slow at first and sped up with wear. I race predator, so I assumed it was the thickness of the tires slowing me down, but I suppose the tires also got harder (my durometer gave out on me). I know Payne uses a Jones machine I'm not sure about FBR. I have a few main questions. Primarily what do you guys ask for when you get tires cut. I know there are templates for the Jones machine, but I haven't found a list online. What options are there, and which ones do you guys like for TN? What thickness do you like? I've yet to encounter a situation where I felt like a thicker tire would be faster, but I'm also only wrapping up my first season.
 
Type of cut (flat, semi round, round) will depend on the track…high bite is a flat cut, low bite is a round cut.

Thickness will also depend on the track, class, and other factors
 
The shape of the contact patch is determined by a number of factors; class, engine, weight, available track grip, track temperature, even some chassis like flatter/rounder cuts than others. Same will be true with preps.
There is no "one size fits all" answer but there are some generalizations.
We will typically ask a customer where they are racing (what track(s)) since we have a pretty good database to work off of with all of the tires we've done through the years. There will almost always be someone running the same track already on our tire program. So, we already have some knowledge of what that track takes for tires already. We'll want to know what stagger you prefer to run currently. Then we'll ask what class (engine and weight.) Sometimes that will make a difference, sometimes not so much. The corner entry speed really makes more difference on higher biting tracks than on low bite tracks. If we're trying to free the car up or gain more sidebite will help us determine what shape/template to use.
Currently, we have 8 different right side Burris 33 templates alone for our Jones machine. Most of those are custom. Larry will make a template for anyone if you just send him the tire that you want duplicated or let him know dimensions that vary from a current template that he offers. The stock templates are good enough for most. Most of the professional tire guys will have their own templates - not much different than with cams and engine builders - something unique that sets them apart and offers something better than the stock stuff.
Cutting the shoulders, specifically on a thick rubber tire like a 33, will change the spring rate of that tire. The thinner you cut the shoulder, the softer the spring rate of that tire will be.
Out of our 8 right side templates, there are two that are our "go to" profiles. Our Vector Cutz High Crown, which is nearly as round as you can make a 33 (we do have one even rounder yet,) and our Vector Cutz Intermediate, which has a low crown between the dots and only cuts to the first mold line on a 33. Those two profiles will cover most local racing applications and are by far our most popular choices.
HC.jpg

This is a photo of our Vector Cutz High Crown Burris 33A

Inter.jpg

This is one of our Vector Cutz Intermediate 33As. Note the difference of the crown in the center between the wear dots and the shoulder area where the HC is cut down past the second mold line while the Inter. stops at the first mold line.

You would use the rounder HC profile on low bite tracks where you need more sidebite.
You would use the Inter. profile when the track gets good (feature time) and requires more roll speed and not as much sidebite.

Hope that helps!

-----
🏁Thanks and God bless,
Brian Carlson
Carlson Racing Engines
Vector Cutz
www.CarlsonMotorsports.com
Carlson Motorsports on Facebook
www.youtube.com
34 years of service to the karting industry ~ 1Cor 9:24
Linden, IN
765-339-4407
bcarlson@CarlsonMotorsports.com
 
CarterTalley said:
I've got a 2 sets of tires cut by both Payne Speedshop (knox area) and FBR in Newport TN. I liked both sets, but felt like both were super slow at first and sped up with wear. I race predator, so I assumed it was the thickness of the tires slowing me down, but I suppose the tires also got harder (my durometer gave out on me). I know Payne uses a Jones machine I'm not sure about FBR. I have a few main questions. Primarily what do you guys ask for when you get tires cut. I know there are templates for the Jones machine, but I haven't found a list online. What options are there, and which ones do you guys like for TN? What thickness do you like? I've yet to encounter a situation where I felt like a thicker tire would be faster, but I'm also only wrapping up my first season.
Click to expand...
I'd recommend calling Austin at FBR or Austin at PSS to discuss. These guys know the tracks you run and can provide the support you're needing. The new Jones machine doesn't use a template. Simply share what class / classes you plan on running and what your tire program looks like. They'll provide the best solution they can for your budget. It makes a difference if you're trying to re-run tires or run the same tires at both track you listed. The solution they share with you may be different than what they do with another racer based on what their tire program looks like.
 
CarlsonMotorsports said:
The shape of the contact patch is determined by a number of factors; class, engine, weight, available track grip, track temperature, even some chassis like flatter/rounder cuts than others. Same will be true with preps.
There is no "one size fits all" answer but there are some generalizations.
We will typically ask a customer where they are racing (what track(s)) since we have a pretty good database to work off of with all of the tires we've done through the years. There will almost always be someone running the same track already on our tire program. So, we already have some knowledge of what that track takes for tires already. We'll want to know what stagger you prefer to run currently. Then we'll ask what class (engine and weight.) Sometimes that will make a difference, sometimes not so much. The corner entry speed really makes more difference on higher biting tracks than on low bite tracks. If we're trying to free the car up or gain more sidebite will help us determine what shape/template to use.
Currently, we have 8 different right side Burris 33 templates alone for our Jones machine. Most of those are custom. Larry will make a template for anyone if you just send him the tire that you want duplicated or let him know dimensions that vary from a current template that he offers. The stock templates are good enough for most. Most of the professional tire guys will have their own templates - not much different than with cams and engine builders - something unique that sets them apart and offers something better than the stock stuff.
Cutting the shoulders, specifically on a thick rubber tire like a 33, will change the spring rate of that tire. The thinner you cut the shoulder, the softer the spring rate of that tire will be.
Out of our 8 right side templates, there are two that are our "go to" profiles. Our Vector Cutz High Crown, which is nearly as round as you can make a 33 (we do have one even rounder yet,) and our Vector Cutz Intermediate, which has a low crown between the dots and only cuts to the first mold line on a 33. Those two profiles will cover most local racing applications and are by far our most popular choices.
View attachment 25273
This is a photo of our Vector Cutz High Crown Burris 33A

View attachment 25274
This is one of our Vector Cutz Intermediate 33As. Note the difference of the crown in the center between the wear dots and the shoulder area where the HC is cut down past the second mold line while the Inter. stops at the first mold line.

You would use the rounder HC profile on low bite tracks where you need more sidebite.
You would use the Inter. profile when the track gets good (feature time) and requires more roll speed and not as much sidebite.

Hope that helps!

-----
🏁Thanks and God bless,
Brian Carlson
Carlson Racing Engines
Vector Cutz
www.CarlsonMotorsports.com
Carlson Motorsports on Facebook
www.youtube.com
34 years of service to the karting industry ~ 1Cor 9:24
Linden, IN
765-339-4407
bcarlson@CarlsonMotorsports.com
Click to expand...
Yes this is super helpful. Thanks for all the info.
 
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