Track Tac

Stagger?

M

MiCkEyDeAn

New member
Ok ive measured a track and come up with needing an 1 1/8 stagger .. Ok the question is whats the best way to apply this ??? 1 1/8 on the front 1 on rear or 1 1/4 on the front and 1 1/8 on the rear ??? These are not the only choices im just wanting to know the best way to apply the stagger needed vs the turn radious to kart set up
 
MiCkEyDeAn said:
Ok ive measured a track and come up with needing an 1 1/8 stagger .. Ok the question is whats the best way to apply this ??? 1 1/8 on the front 1 on rear or 1 1/4 on the front and 1 1/8 on the rear ??? These are not the only choices im just wanting to know the best way to apply the stagger needed vs the turn radious to kart set up
Click to expand...
you came up with needing 1 1/8 stagger? Normally that would mean on the rear. But I'm not real sure what you're talking about. What measuring did you do? What calculation did you make to come up with that 1 1/8 number.

From the desk of Al Nunley
Comments compliments criticisms and questions always welcome.
If the data does not support the theory, get a new theory. (Al Nunley)
 
alvin l nunley said:
you came up with needing 1 1/8 stagger? Normally that would mean on the rear. But I'm not real sure what you're talking about. What measuring did you do? What calculation did you make to come up with that 1 1/8 number.

From the desk of Al Nunley
Comments compliments criticisms and questions always welcome.
If the data does not support the theory, get a new theory. (Al Nunley)
Click to expand...

Al im using the radius of the turn and tire roll out and center of rr tire and lr tire
 
MiCkEyDeAn said:
So your saying that normaly a 1/4 more on the front than what the tracks turns measure out
Click to expand...

No. Most (99.9%) set FRONT stagger to 1 /38 - 1 1/2 regardless of track configuration or turn radius. If you are going to use turn radius as a way to figure your stagger, that should be done on the REAR stagger.
 
What Bryan just said----Set your front stagger somewhere from 1 1/4"-1 1/2" and don't mess with it. Most lf tires roll out about 32 3/4 and most rf about 34 if one is a bit larger or smaller don't freak out about it on the front end. A little more front stagger will raise cross slightly and a little less will do the opposite. Adjusting rear stagger is more important in my opinion. Most tracks that we race on will need 1"-1 1/2" rear stagger with some exceptions(never less than 1")--experience comes in to play here. Get the kart on the scales and see where you are as far as setup numbers then work form there.. We scale peoples karts from time to time that haven't ever seen a scales and have no idea what their numbers are---hard to make good adjustments when they have no idea where they are. John
 
johnelliott said:
What Bryan just said----Set your front stagger somewhere from 1 1/4"-1 1/2" and don't mess with it. Most lf tires roll out about 32 3/4 and most rf about 34 if one is a bit larger or smaller don't freak out about it on the front end. A little more front stagger will raise cross slightly and a little less will do the opposite. Adjusting rear stagger is more important in my opinion. Most tracks that we race on will need 1"-1 1/2" rear stagger with some exceptions(never less than 1")--experience comes in to play here. Get the kart on the scales and see where you are as far as setup numbers then work form there.. We scale peoples karts from time to time that haven't ever seen a scales and have no idea what their numbers are---hard to make good adjustments when they have no idea where they are. John
Click to expand...

I have scales ... I focus on tires more tho .. It took me to the top alot last year ... Just seems the more i can learn from experienced guys the better the application at the track
 
We scale our stuff every race and often between heats and features---check cambers and overall numbers. You can't overlook any part of the whole package in my opinion, John
 
MiCkEyDeAn said:
I have scales ... I focus on tires more tho .. It took me to the top alot last year ... Just seems the more i can learn from experienced guys the better the application at the track
Click to expand...

A good set of tires on a kart that has the correct numbers on it would be better than a kart with a great set of tires and a bad set up. :)
 
MiCkEyDeAn said:
Al im using the radius of the turn and tire roll out and center of rr tire and lr tire
Click to expand...
that's exactly how my spreadsheet does it. I also have a spreadsheet that will tell you how much to adjust your center to center measurement, depending on the banking of the track. It's all theoretical of course, but a good place to start. One must never forget; "tuning is tough".

From the desk of Al Nunley
Comments compliments criticisms and questions always welcome.
If the data does not support the theory, get a new theory. (Al Nunley)
 
alvin l nunley said:
that's exactly how my spreadsheet does it. I also have a spreadsheet that will tell you how much to adjust your center to center measurement, depending on the banking of the track. It's all theoretical of course, but a good place to start. One must never forget; "tuning is tough".

From the desk of Al Nunley
Comments compliments criticisms and questions always welcome.
If the data does not support the theory, get a new theory. (Al Nunley)
Click to expand...


Yes tuning is tuff ... I will be only running one local track this year ... I was fast there last year the two times i ran it ... So looking to nail the right set up for this track this year
 
if you change the front stagger during the day of racing and do not change anything else will this change the handling of the kart?
 
^^^ absolutely it will.... Cross, camber, toe, and ride height is just a few things that come to mind with a front stagger change. You would be surprised at how much of a change it can make with even just an air pressure adjustment. The best thing anyone can ever do is put the kart on the scales and make the change and go over EVERYTHING and take notes as to what all "moved".
 
4c racing said:
if you change the front stagger during the day of racing and do not change anything else will this change the handling of the kart?
Click to expand...
From what I've read here, people adjust handling by moving one washer on the spindle, from the top to the bottom or vice versa. Changing stagger, by that small amount, would have to be difficult, even if you wanted to. So taking all that into consideration, I would think any change in stagger would change the handling.

From the desk of Al Nunley
Comments compliments criticisms and questions always welcome.
If the data does not support the theory, get a new theory. (Al Nunley)
 
turn4racing said:
^^^ absolutely it will.... Cross, camber, toe, and ride height is just a few things that come to mind with a front stagger change. You would be surprised at how much of a change it can make with even just an air pressure adjustment. The best thing anyone can ever do is put the kart on the scales and make the change and go over EVERYTHING and take notes as to what all "moved".
Click to expand...

just pointing out agreed if you know your kart is right before the stagger change, however if there thinking of changing it's most likely for a reason so sometimes ya make the change and boom just what it wanted. point being not all changes have a negative effect.
sorry tom used your post because i know your always trying to help.
 
turn4racing said:
^^^ absolutely it will.... Cross, camber, toe, and ride height is just a few things that come to mind with a front stagger change. You would be surprised at how much of a change it can make with even just an air pressure adjustment. The best thing anyone can ever do is put the kart on the scales and make the change and go over EVERYTHING and take notes as to what all "moved".
Click to expand...

Good advice in the first step to understanding how things work dynamically on the track.

Everything is about physics. Specifically about about the physics of weight in motion. Add in geometry and you have the physics of weight in motion compiled by the affects of angular direction of that weight. FUN STUFF!!! :)
 
Thanks guys i really am glad to get your responses ... If i may ask another question ... At the end of last season i had added 1/2 inch stagger to both the front and rear putting me at 1 7/8 and it put my kart on a rail ... What adjustments if any could i do to my kart to get it to handle the same way but with less stagger ... Im asking this because i think i can get more out of it ... If i put it on the scales and run it with the same numbers but with less stagger ill be right back where i was ... The track i will be running this year has some pretty long straights like 50meters .. This is reason im asking ... Scrub has to come into play here in my eyes ... The track also has 75ft radius turns and i was ramming the track champ last year so i know im close thanx
 
MiCkEyDeAn said:
... What adjustments if any could i do to my kart to get it to handle the same way but with less stagger ...
Click to expand...
if you post your percentages now, I can tell you how to change the weight, but I can't tell you if it will still handle good with less stagger.

From the desk of Al Nunley
Comments compliments criticisms and questions always welcome.
If the data does not support the theory, get a new theory. (Al Nunley)
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top