Track Tac

Update on how to use what you race entering and in a turn

paulkish

paulkish

old fart
1. Brake
2. Slow
3. Turn
4. Insert Arc
5. Set Speed
6. Maintain speed as needed
7. Begin next turn after setting new speed to repeat 1 thru 6.

The process is complex with total driver skill being their ability to include the most of all of the process per amount of time available.
 
I don't know if it's the fabulous amount of interest in this thread, being I got up too too early, the coffee, board-um, I felt like throwing out more bs or just dumb ignorance but here goes.

1. Brake= if your getting too fast on the straight for the upcoming turn your going to have to brake or hit something to be able to make the turn.
That was an easy one.

2. Slow= To get good use out of the front tires to turn generally before you turn, somethings got to start you going slower be it the bank of the track, a little more braking or burping the throttle to get weight started to the fronts for grip.
I think that's easy to thunk on too.

3. Turn= Now that you've slowed from speed on the straight and got your front tires where they will work for you you can get into the real part of the turn.
Ok, easy again? You slowed and you got some grip started up front so you can get thru the rest of the turn.

4. Insert Arc= Now your in the turn and weight has moved to the right getting you more bite/grip for the turn then you had when entering. At this time you can put your foot into it and run at the ragged edge, if there a ton of grip you can if your dumb force the engine down via grip with your foot to the floor, you can keep your pedal to the metal and grind off speed because of grip, or you can set a good speed a little over entry and carry momentum. The Arc is there because it will no matter if it's tiny or large allow you to keep the most momentum going for a distance or period of time. That's what you see when after that slow looking thing on the track completes a time trial lap and you hear "QUICK TIME !".
Doesn't matter how much arc your able to use the arc part will allow you to carry the most momentum no matter what other configuration you travel and also will likely place you at a better exit point.
If nobody sees it yet it ain't my fault I've tried and I suggest you start looking for it from the sidelines and trying to find it when your on the track.
And it ain't about being smooooooooth, it's about using what your sitting on in an efficient way.

5. Set Speed= As the bs pointed out above your already into the arc momentum saving part and your going to set your speed again most likely and possible because of the new outside grip you have, to as little or as much as possible above your entry speed. It won't look like it if your into it but it will be possible to run at least part and more of the corner at a speed higher then entry. ... even if it looks slow.

6. Maintain speed as needed= See 4. and 5. and as needed is to put you in a position and speed for the next part of the turn you see, be it the start of exit or just continuing onto the straight. By the way there ain't no apex.

7. Begin next turn after setting new speed to repeat 1 thru 6. = no explanation needed see 1 thru 6 if you ain't finished an end of the track or get on it again down the straight which if you used 1 thru 6 to your best advantage, will be as long a straight as possible.

This getting around the track thing is about not loosing any more speed as possible thru the turns, putting your line where you have the best racing advantage or on a line where you can best take advantage of what the track has to offer in the way of more saved momentum or helped acceleration from the bank of the track where possible.

Rule #1. Do your braking and turning going up hill and your acceleration going down hill.
By the way if you hear Rule #1 from anyone else it's origin is me. ... :)

Sure if you have the hp you can put your low gear to it going up hill coming off the turn when possible and when there's grip/bite for you to do it, butt this ain't about hp stuff is it?

answer: nope it's about both and using what your sitting your butt in in the most efficient way.
You all know how to race already learn how to use your stuff in the best way it can be used to be fast.
All you got to do is be fast and the odds of winning will be there for you.
The rest is about luck and the work you put into the thing you sit on before you race it. ... :)

... now where's that coffee the bs is over and if you read this far thanks for the time you wasted getting here. ... :)
 
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I've never been much on using brakes, get the car turning in good on the gas is when its the fastest for me. Brake pedal was more of a comfort thing incase SHTF.
 
racinnut15xm said:
I've never been much on using brakes, get the car turning in good on the gas is when its the fastest for me. Brake pedal was more of a comfort thing incase SHTF.
Click to expand...

Thank you and I understand your comment.

I think low or high hp anytime track grip forces an engine to slow with the pedal to the metal it increase recovery time needed to accelerate.
... I think that might be pretty much key to this discussion. I think the insert arc part with the go pedal eased up even on low hp allows for a quicker start/transition from slowing or maintaining speed to acceleration. If your both on the ragged edge of hp and grip then it probably won't allow for more efficiency, but how often is anyone on both the ragged edge of grip and hp? It's so easy to use what you race beyond it's hp and even easier to race below your level of grip.

Your not getting any argument from me just new thoughts and perspective brought on by the discussion you offered. This simple go around in a circle ain't that easy nor cut and dry. ... :)
 
LOL, either i'm right on the money or so far out into left field it's dumber then dumb and more ... :)

I think i'm right on the money. yeah sure ??????????????
 
In the racing we do, slight deceleration is all we do on corner entry. Brakes if something is wrong unless the kart is messed up or if youre trying to correct a corner entry problem. Corner speed is key. Braking is key
in road course racing but not oval. Do nothing to slow corner speed.
 
mike97760 said:
Do nothing to slow corner speed.
Click to expand...

It's impossible to accelerate if you have not first slowed down.
In my list slowing down is done for specific purpose.
First to set entry speed from the end of the straight which is fastest part of the oval.
And second the slight slowing I think your describing to get some weight moved to the fronts to assist with entry.
Once in the turn lateral forces will take care of adding weight to your right side tires enabling you to slightly increase your roll/arc speed/momentum maintaining speed.
In my expression of what I see it can be not just maintaining momentum but to slightly gain and maintain your gain as additional momentum after corner entry.

In this i'm trying to totally look at thru the total corner from the perspective of what normally happens and what is needed to efficiently get thru a corner or one end of the track.

Corner entry is not always a defined immediate entry. It's also about how far you can carry speed into the corner before you set and 'turn' as in 3..
Though I'm looking for the overall or maybe ultimate theory of corner efficiency, for it to be correct it has to be able to logically bring in both high hp applications where either speed or hp so easily puts you over the limit of grip and low hp situations where you must free things up to get to to the limit of grip.
How you attack it to run close or at the limit of grip will depend on weather your approaching the limit of grip from an excess of speed and hp or from being limited on speed and hp.
I think but not yet sure I'm offering a logical list of things to shoot for and more importantly if your not there each will become identifiable as on track problems needing corrected the same as loose and push.

Back to your good example of "slight deceleration" I'm seeing the slight deceleration as a useful and needed function as 3..
Total deceleration will include braking done if your at a higher rate of speed then possible for corner entry and what speed is taken off by grip/turning into the banking of the track going up hill.

... thanks and later got to get another coffee. ... :)
 
This question is not to argue any past point I may have dumbly made.
It's for my own thoughts and thunkin on the viability or how realistic what I offered is.

I'll ask the question in terms of a basic stock predator and common but not exact tire/gear ratio.
Not being exact will keep Al out of the bs. ... :)

Hypothetically and for thunkin purposes i'll say rpm's drop is 200 at each end of the track.
With any normal setup for what ever size track your thinking about...

How many miles per hour would you expect the 200 rpm drop slow you down at each end of the track.
Depending on what size track and track configuration your thinking about will get you a different answer.
Your thoughs about the track and gearing will be different but Al's spread sheet will help pin point an answer for you.
Naturally Al will demand something exact but this is just for the purpose of a rough answer for what folks think about.
I think it will be interesting to see if the rpm drop will carry across the many tracks racers may be thinking about and end up about the same loss of miles per hour at each end of the track. but ain't got a clue at this point. ?????????????????????

... again clueless ... :)
 
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