Which pipe is better for open clones or flatheads

DRC21

Member
What my question is that does loop headers make a difference from others?
For clones i run a regular superbox header. Wonder if the loop headers are better?
For my Flathead i run a straight 3 stage header with flared end. I have a loop header i can put on it. I dont know what would be better. Thanks
 
My info is dated.i never ran clone only flathead.when the loop-e-loop first came out every body got one including me.everybody claimed 3 to 5 tengths faster.bullcrap but they did sound cool.in my opinion most headers sold are about the same or pretty darn close.i would not waste my time on headers "setup"setup"setup"run the header that came with engine cool does not win setup and tires win races.good luck
 
Simple answer test the two.long drawn out never ending questions and studying see above^^^^^^man karting has changed.
 
i have always prefered my pigtail loop header with the flared end. just a dump pipe that you can put a muffler on is slower with my motor. with the pigtail i can pull anybody down the straight. with the dump pipe, im throwing my cowboy rope out to the guy ahead of me and trying to reel them in lol.
in my personal experience- there is a very noticable difference!
 
Look at it this way, pipes are not that expensive, if a pipe came out that was faster than all the others, it wouldn't take long before everybody would be using it.
Observing what pipe the top four qualifiers, (in all the classes) are using is, in my opinion, the best way to decide which is best. The four cycle pipe, unlike the two cycle expansion chamber, has Little to do with increases or decreases in horsepower. There's some, but not a lot. There is more, compared to the stock exhaust, but between all the pipes, I doubt very seriously if there's a whole lot. Of course every little bit helps.
I have to believe that guy with fast time has tried everything, so run what he runs.
If you run the same pipe as the fast qualifier, you can establish a baseline, and then experiment with different pipes.
 
I'd say that your engine builder would know best what pipe works best with your engine combination. Just like jetting, cams, ignition timing, etc. these things (including pipes) all have to work together.

The last thing I want one of my engine customers doing, is swapping out pipes one after the other. For instance, most loop pipes require .0015" - .002" less jet in a flathead carburetor than a muffler header. Hey, it's their money, but it's still my decal on the side of that engine. I want that engine performing at it's peak and up front!

There IS a "best" pipe for your engine, and there are lots of "not as good" pipes.


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Thanks and God bless,
Brian Carlson
Carlson Racing Engines
Vector Cuts
www.CarlsonMotorsports.com
Celebrating 25 years of service to the karting industry
765-339-4407
bcarlson@CarlsonMotorsports.com
 
I build my own headers and even mufflers because I have access to a fab shop and my own tig welder at home.
This gave me some opportunities to play with a lot of different tubing sizes and lengths.
The question people should be asking, is what pipe for _______ track?
My general observation, bigger inside diameter moved the power "UP". Smaller diameter came off the corners better but choked on the straight. I started with a piece of 1"x .080" (.840 inside diameter)tubing for my 1st header, then made a smaller one and couple bigger ones.
Jetting changed drastically between the different headers. My engine needed to be richer with a weenie sized header(5/8" inside), because it retained too much heat and was pinging. We're open pipe so that one went in the scrap bin. Next, I fabbed up a biggie, 1-1/8 x .060. The engine wouldn't hardly run until I put replaced my 38 main with a 40, then it was still a little lean. Off the corner it died, down the straight it flew! Next up, 1"x .060". ended up going down to a Honda main jet that was kind of in between the 38 and 40. A better balance coming off the turns and straightaway umph.....but ultimately our track has 19 turns to exit and only two straights of any distance. I ended up putting the original back on. Something I see a lot of, is head pipes that terminate into the flange at 90*. Well, the exhaust port is not 90* to the flange surface. Think about it. I angle cut the end of the pipe and weld it on to the flange such that it's a straight shot.
For mufflers, you'll laugh, but I make my own little glass packs. I use .049 perforated metal with 1/8" holes, which I form around a chunk of 1" round bar in a vise, then stainless pop rivet into a tube. The tube then gets 1" washers tapped onto, then welded to each end. I then wrap the perforated metal tube with header wrap and secure at each end with thin hose clamps. Depending on what the o.d. of your washers are, this core will slip into a chunk of 2" to 2-1/2" exhaust pipe, sometimes grinding a little bit off of the washers outside diameter. I slip the core about 1/3rd of the way into the pipe, then pack it with muffler packing and wiggle it the rest of the way in.....then weld it up. They sound good, it quiets the engine down a lot and takes the rasp out of it, but still flows great. The header wrap used inside keeps the packing from burning up and blowing out.
 
Great post mr carlson.we trusted our builder 100%.if your paying someone 1000-1500 to build you should be able to put that part of your program on his shoulders and take his advice.if you cant do that find another builder that will.i no clones dont cost 1500 but some flat head builders could and would get that in 1999. Our team tried "beef,robison,todd miller,mishue,bullet,b-man,welch,hillard,and in house.they were all great engines but if our setup was off guess what we did not win.these engines do not produce enough power to win with a bad setup.if your tight "pushing" up the track you are in trouble.sorry to get off topic.but in karting setup and tires is everything.if your focusing on a header pipe your already miles behind the guy that does not have to.
 
IMAG1381_zpscf6cf79c.jpg

megaphone...
get pipe max
play with the lengths
figure out what power you come off the corner and what you end the straight at
end of straight rpm the length of the header
beginning of corner is the long end of megaphone
6x the area of the port is the diameter of the large end of the megaphone,
you get the angle from this
and run as small as possible exhaust tubing,
ours goes inside our port,
its 1 5/8 and its making around 80hp



take a look at the ama flat track bikes
all megaphones.
a DND megaphone on a crf450 makes 5hp more peak than a pro ciricut pipe after peak 9hp at the rev limiter
reverse meg or waste power.
 
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