Beginners,,,,,,know what you're buying

H

H1Motorsport

Member
Twice in the last few years, I have been asked to access the karts that new folk to karting have already bought to enter the sport . Some of these folk actually do not know or have been mislead on what kind of chassis they have bought ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,. I could go into details for a long time .But beginners , please take my advice and hookup with an experienced karter to assist you in buying your first equipment . Trust me,,,,,it will save you a lot of frustration and money .
 
I'm likely to get involved helping a friend buy his first kart. My worry is when you buy a kart starting out you need everything and it's likely to have a lot of stuff hung on the chassis.

That leads me to worry about if the hardly ever shinny, never wrecked kart is bent and you can't see it. Here's my question. Could you learn if the kart was not bent by taking the wheels and hubs off of it and setting it on maybe the floor of an indoor swap meet? Or would seat struts, body work and other things prevent you from being able to tell if it was bent. Or will even a good not bent kart rock when the frame is put on something flat.

Is there a good or pretty good way to tell your getting a chassis that isn't bent?

H1Motorsports, I'm of the opinion we all paid too much for our first kart. I know I did. ... :)
 
IMHO, it would depend on where it's bent, and if you can still get it to scale out where you need it, what difference would it make if you could still win races with it.?
 
jack burroughs said:
IMHO, it would depend on where it's bent, and if you can still get it to scale out where you need it, what difference would it make if you could still win races with it.?
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Jack , i have a funny for you . i had a older U-max once . it never would act rite with factory #'z when scaling then........................ i hit the wall with it at a indoor event!!!!!!!!:eek: bent it up good in the front ....peplaced some front end parts ,tweeked chassis a lil & tweeked the #'z a lil for scaling and it was a rocket afterwards LOL bent chassis was hauling the mail man !!!
 
Be sure to check and pay close attention to front spindles especially, look for chipped or flaking paint near the welds or spindle arms or on the frame, chipped/flaking paint usually is a sign of a bent piece, not always but 9 times out of 10 if its flaking anywhere other than the bottom of the frame rails or the motor mount rails, its likely bent. I would prefer to buy a chassis I have seen perform on the track personally and not something I've never seen, but that is just me. Also check for stripped Heim joint nuts or other bolts, if stripped nuts or heims are left that way that should tell you that person obviously didn't care enough about it to fix torn up parts and that would lead me to look elsewhere for a chassis. Taking an experienced racer with you is good advice, better yet ask them to suggest a chassis for you that someone they know is selling, those are usually the better deals even if they aren't always the cheapest. For a new racer, a 06-08 Millenium Tempest or Ultramax Badmax around the same year are really good choices to start with, both chassis are very easy to learn with, not too sensitive to tire selection, and can be made fast on just about any track condition, especially lower bite or small tracks.

I still have a 2008 Tempest myself and have won alot of big races with it this past season, including a track championship in the open class and several big races at money shows, they can still compete with the right setup and right tires on them. We have an 06 tempest as well that has dominated the box stock class all season long
 
Good advice, H1.
Buying a used kart, engine package, etc from a reputable dealer (locally or otherwise) can be an important step in assuring that you are getting what you think you are getting. No doubt there are some great deals out there (including listings on this site) from sell-outs, etc, but for someone brand new to the sport, it can be a big gamble without knowing exactly what you are getting.

As far as chassis being bent....Last I checked, they ALL are bent from the factory. ;) Seriously though, if the chassis won't scale out right, the beginner will be fighting an uphill battle and really put themselves behind in the set-up learning curve.
There is no good way to accurately check most kart chassis at a swap meet. A surface plate, jig table, or at the very least a set of scales would be the only way to get that information.

Likewise, purchasing a used engine can be a huge gamble. Is the engine fresh, needs freshened/updated, is it even legal? Again, unless the buyer knows (and trusts) the seller personally, buying a used engine is a gamble. Not many sellers will allow you to pull the head or sidecover off their engine for sale, and even then the newbie buyer isn't going to tell much.

Buying from a dealer may cost a few more dollars, but the peace of mind can be well worth it.
At the very least, taking another experienced kart racer with you to look at a potential purchase can be valuable as well.




-----
Thanks and God bless,
Brian Carlson
Carlson Racing Engines
Vector Cutz
www.CarlsonMotorsports.com
27 years of service to the karting industry
Linden, IN
765-339-4407
bcarlson@CarlsonMotorsports.com
 
Hummmm... Maybe an enterprising person might rent space at swap meets and for a fee scale karts for prospective buyers with the buyer in the kart. A prospective buyer would at least know if it comes close to something reasonable. It's still taking a chance and the scale person would be able to let even those without experience know if it's at least close.

I don't think it would take many karts scaled to make up the cost of a booth or area. And there's no reason the scale person couldn't also sell stuff there too, so long as they didn't sell rollers. The scale person could have a mock up engine available to be set on a chassis that wasn't race ready.

The swap meet promoters could even advertise "so and so" would be available for a fee, to scale and inspect karts at the swap meet.
 
paulkish said:
Hummmm... Maybe an enterprising person might rent space at swap meets and for a fee scale karts for prospective buyers with the buyer in the kart. A prospective buyer would at least know if it comes close to something reasonable. It's still taking a chance and the scale person would be able to let even those without experience know if it's at least close.

I don't think it would take many karts scaled to make up the cost of a booth or area. And there's no reason the scale person couldn't also sell stuff there too, so long as they didn't sell rollers. The scale person could have a mock up engine available to be set on a chassis that wasn't race ready.

The swap meet promoters could even advertise "so and so" would be available for a fee, to scale and inspect karts at the swap meet.
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Add a dyno too! :)
 
I think considering the racing I've seen over the years, and some of the hard crashes, any kart that is more than a few years old isn't the same dimensionally as when it came off the jig. It's possible to bend or twist a kart after a hard crash but it doesn't show a bulge or buckle in the frame. You'll notice it when all of a sudden the percentages change yet you didn't make any adjustments. That is assuming you didn't bend a spindle or axle. With that being said, sometimes the kart will run just as fast or faster after that happens. Slight changes in the frame dimensions are almost impossible to detect without the original jig. With that being said, it's the buckled or kinked tube that you need to look for. I have to laugh when I see "like new never bent" "very fast". Nobody is going to post my kart was wrecked multiple times, is all twisted up, and is slower than molasses. Like anything else, you are always taking a risk buying used unless you know the seller and the equipment personally.....
 
Buying a used kart is a gamble IMO. It'll be hard to tell if it's bent by just looking. You wont really know until you scale it out and can't get your numbers, but then it's too late. However, chipped paint near bends or welders are not good signs. Also, cracked floor pans can be an indication one of the rails are bents.
 
You guys realize what these things cost right? If im selling a race used item for less than 60% of new cost and i have a buyer 110 questioning me about paint chips and yada yada im going to laugh him off and tell him to buy a new one if your that anal you cant have champagne taste on a coca cola wallet fellas.....your not gonna get a 2016 recon for $500.00 for $500.00 your gonna get a $500.00 kart paint chips and all lol!!
 
phantom20J said:
You guys realize what these things cost right? If im selling a race used item for less than 60% of new cost and i have a buyer 110 questioning me about paint chips and yada yada im going to laugh him off and tell him to buy a new one if your that anal you cant have champagne taste on a coca cola wallet fellas.....your not gonna get a 2016 recon for $500.00 for $500.00 your gonna get a $500.00 kart paint chips and all lol!!
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I don't see where anyone said don't buy a kart with paint chips or flaking paint. The comment was to look for chipped paint or flaking paint which might indicate and lead one to discover a significant problem that otherwise might not get noticed. It's not the paint, it's the bent tube or frame.
 
brittainracing said:
most manufacurers will check chassis out for you i know phantom will
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Bought a kart from a seemingly well known guy that had a son racing, out of Berea, KY...... Met him outside of Knoxville, bought an 07 Tempest from him back in 2011.... Long story short, this guy sold me a kart that never would scale even close to Millennium specs. So I loaded it up and took it to the factory in Greenville and they put it in the jig.... Bent beyond repair with anything they had available........ Be careful, real careful..... Some people, like this guy, have no morals at all....
 
Good advice in here. A local guy here in upstate NY named Jeremy Tuttle stole from us pretty badly when i was first trying to get my son started. It almost turned us away from karting completely.

Do lots of asking around before you give anyone any money!!!!
 
I almost bought a regular road coarse kart for dirt. Untill that 1 guy said "make sure its an offset frame". That would have been a very bad experience.
 
mixinmaster said:
Bought a kart from a seemingly well known guy that had a son racing, out of Berea, KY...... Met him outside of Knoxville, bought an 07 Tempest from him back in 2011.... Long story short, this guy sold me a kart that never would scale even close to Millennium specs. So I loaded it up and took it to the factory in Greenville and they put it in the jig.... Bent beyond repair with anything they had available........ Be careful, real careful..... Some people, like this guy, have no morals at all....
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I would really like to know who this guy is just to avoid dealing with him anytime in the future. Send a message please If you don't mind...thanks. I have a good idea who it is anyways but want to be sure
 
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