Track Tac

do you really have to have a huge name engine builder!

see I got my kart good and Im winning and I was just curious cause I see all these different engine builders and wonder whats so different but thanks!
 
The direct answer to your question is a NO..
A great engine cannot over come a bad set up or poor tire preperation...
You will see many will say tires tires tires,, are they wrong.. Well basically no...
BUT when you step up the ladder in competition just tires and set up will get you in the game but when all the others in the class also up on their game you'd better have some HP on your side..
NOW HP can be produced at home,, sometimes by accident and some by hard work.. But you have to figure if a person is earning a living building engines he foresure has to be doing something right..
 
Do you accually think your getting the best of the best when calling the big names? You getting a good motor, but nothing more then a local builder ca do for you. Your money should be in tires and setup, not engine.
 
We have won races on our own engines, but day-in, day-out, it's hard to beat someone that does it every single day and sees hundreds of these engines. It sure makes you feel good to beat the big names when you can.
 
In all my years of racing the McCullough's, nobody ever built any of my engines. Even after switching to the KT and the Rotary valves, after Terry Ives blueprinted them, I did the rebuilds and the between race maintenance myself. Let's face it, blueprinting an engine requires some very expensive tools. Even rebuilding, after the blueprint, requires some expensive measuring and assembly tools, and the knowledge of how to use them.

From the desk of Al Nunley
Comments compliments criticisms and questions always welcome.
If the data does not support the theory, get a new theory.(Al Nunley
 
brs11 said:
Do you accually think your getting the best of the best when calling the big names? You getting a good motor, but nothing more then a local builder ca do for you. Your money should be in tires and setup, not engine.
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Need to disagree with you on this. When you call any engine builder with a long history, you might not be getting the best in the beginning. But I can bet you the engine will have some tricks that most backyard guys know of. Such as cam setup, pipe to match, way carb is built, and so on. Takes years of experience. Expecially with a flathead.
 
IMO, The big thing is being able to get it through tech. Putting one together is not hard at all. Buying the parts and assembling it is easy. Learning the small but very important tricks that the engine builders know takes a lot of time to learn. Having a dyno, and a set of tech tools just for home use is expensive. Not to even mention the equipment to machine the parts. At least in the GC type racing you'd have to own a set of tech tools if your going through tech.

Then add into the picture most of us have our hands full just figuring out the chassis and tires, then add in sorting out the engine.

Engines are easy to assemble. Very hard to get that last ounce of available power out of.

Ben Braun
 
ben said:
IMO, The big thing is being able to get it through tech. Putting one together is not hard at all. Buying the parts and assembling it is easy. Learning the small but very important tricks that the engine builders know takes a lot of time to learn. Having a dyno, and a set of tech tools just for home use is expensive. Not to even mention the equipment to machine the parts. At least in the GC type racing you'd have to own a set of tech tools if your going through tech.

Then add into the picture most of us have our hands full just figuring out the chassis and tires, then add in sorting out the engine.

Engines are easy to assemble. Very hard to get that last ounce of available power out of.

Ben Braun
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I agree with this one less thing to have to worry about and I myself think you have a better chance passing tech with one of the big names and for a engine builder to stay in business they are doing the best they can on every engine or you won't come back jmo
 
It all depends on the level of competition. tires and setup are basic, but at top level any advantage counts, and a top engine is one more part of the whole package, and it can also play an important role. Most times it is way cheaper paying a top builder than trying to find out yourself or through a local builder what you need to have a faster LEGAL engine. Now like in everything there are good builders on top and some not so good that base their performance on cheating and get caught too often. Personally my experience with Hi Tech has been wonderful on stock classes and well worth the money I paid while racing Stock Flatheads, and my experience when John Klutz at CKI rebuilt my open 2 stroke engine for UAS was also great. JMO
 
brs11 said:
Do you accually think your getting the best of the best when calling the big names? You getting a good motor, but nothing more then a local builder ca do for you. Your money should be in tires and setup, not engine.
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Do you have any proof to back up your claim? I can tell you that talking with several "big name" builders, there are customers engines that they WISH were their own. Myself included. When I was building a ton of engines, I had several that I wish I could have just kept, but it doesn't work that way. And any "big name" builder has too much respect and pride to "steal" or "keep" an engine from ANY customer. Making the claim you did basically is a slap in the face of any builder with pride in their work and they wouldn't pull a stunt like that and hurt their reputation.

And what's even worse, is to SEE a motor you built that you KNOW has the HP to win any race it enters floundering around in the back of the pack, and even worse than that is to hear that customer bad mouth the engine telling others that it is down on HP. That drives me NUTS. I have actually swapped my personal motor with a customer at a race before that claimed exactly what you did above and thought he wasn't getting a motor as good as my own...... well, when I ran faster with HIS motor..... never heard another complaint.
 
complete the equation: ENGINE + SETUP + TIRES = WINS AND TOP FINISHES.....

no, you don't HAVE to get a motor from a top name builder. No, you don't have to be part of a top name tires program. No.....you don't HAVE to. but your odds of placing higher are definitely better when you get with someone who knows what it takes. i'm building my own engines. I've learned a lot and still learning, but i don't have the expert knowledge it takes to be able to compete on a national or even regional level.

everyone will say that it's all motor or tires or set-up....and they are all partially right. but you can't take the world's best prepped tires and a sloppy set-up with an engine that is down on power compared to the rest of the field and expect to win!! it's just not that simple! if you can't get the kart to rotate thru the corners or an engine that can't keep up, what in the world makes you think that tires are the answer? and jamie, you are 100 percent correct!!! it a shame that a builder, any builder puts hours into a motor that can win any race entered, to see some numb-nut put it on a kart and finish last....because they didn't complete the entire formula.

if you expect to win at anything, you have to....1) want to win....2) properly prepare to win.....3) give yourself every legal advantage that you can....and 4) get your mind set right to go out and win...

dad always told us boys that if we want to race, then race....if you don't do your homework (and i'm not saying that you have to spend every last minute of every day working on the kart)....and you aren't willing to do what it takes....then sell the dang thing and take up bird watching....because you'll get out there, lose your focus and cause problems for those that want to race and want to win....

just sayin.....
 
Thanks guys for your help and I am moving up in competition I just needed to know what was best to do! And what engine to look at thanks!
 
Jamie Webb said:
Do you have any proof to back up your claim? I can tell you that talking with several "big name" builders, there are customers engines that they WISH were their own. Myself included. When I was building a ton of engines, I had several that I wish I could have just kept, but it doesn't work that way. And any "big name" builder has too much respect and pride to "steal" or "keep" an engine from ANY customer. Making the claim you did basically is a slap in the face of any builder with pride in their work and they wouldn't pull a stunt like that and hurt their reputation.

And what's even worse, is to SEE a motor you built that you KNOW has the HP to win any race it enters floundering around in the back of the pack, and even worse than that is to hear that customer bad mouth the engine telling others that it is down on HP. That drives me NUTS. I have actually swapped my personal motor with a customer at a race before that claimed exactly what you did above and thought he wasn't getting a motor as good as my own...... well, when I ran faster with HIS motor..... never heard another complaint.
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Yep!...that frost my butt too. I built a motor for a guy that was a real nice motor. He went to the track and was running in the back and was bad mouthing me and my motor. I told him to bring his driver in and we'll see what's up. When he put the kart on the stand, the right front was toed out about 3 inches. I asked him what was up with that and he said,"that don't have anything to do with it!", I said, you're right....it doesn't have anything to do with the motor. I gave him his money back and took the motor....put it on another kids kart and the kid ran up front. A lot of racers are quick to blame the motor, when it's chassis or tires.
 
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