L0206 vs clone

Dodge, there are so many variables to your question that i'd be just guessing w/ a response. Juniors & lighter racers typically utilize more from the bottom half of the RPM curve, and heavies experience the trade-off between corner exit speed & top-end performance up against the limiter. Sorry, not trying to be vague, Brian eluded to it above. Track configuration, banking, forward bite, chassis flex, & several more enter into the conversation. Bench racers will debate this one forever.
 
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Well I can tell u I turn my 206 about 59-6000 on an 1162. My boy weighs 45 lbs and his total kart weight with lead is 240.
 
Mike- the numbers above were put together when testing slides. Red, Yellow, Blue, and Purple were swapped out in the same engine. All were done on one dyno for the purpose of comparing slides only. It is true that rarely will two dynos yield the same numbers, so most of the guys I know shy away from posting the curves. Temp, air density, and even a couple cool beverages tend to make the HP numbers we see, look odd.
 
Gonzari said:
Mike- the numbers above were put together when testing slides. Red, Yellow, Blue, and Purple were swapped out in the same engine. All were done on one dyno for the purpose of comparing slides only. It is true that rarely will two dynos yield the same numbers, so most of the guys I know shy away from posting the curves. Temp, air density, and even a couple cool beverages tend to make the HP numbers we see, look odd.
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I understand that dynos vary, but are useful for comparison.
What "slide" is the base or least restrictive and what were the other slide numbers for comparison?
 
To optimize engine performance on the long slide motors the carb cap usually needs to be machined, filed or sanded to get the maximum legal opening.
Some times this is a considerable amount since the cap is not a machined surface, nor is the surface of the top of the carb a machined surface and the thickness of the gasket can vary somewhat.
When making HP comparisons between different length slides it should be done at maximum legal opening.
This will require adjusting each carb cap for each colored slide.
 
Jimbo said:
To optimize engine performance on the long slide motors the carb cap usually needs to be machined, filed or sanded to get the maximum legal opening.
Some times this is a considerable amount since the cap is not a machined surface, nor is the surface of the top of the carb a machined surface and the thickness of the gasket can vary somewhat.
When making HP comparisons between different length slides it should be done at maximum legal opening.
This will require adjusting each carb cap for each colored slide.
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Is that legal in the LO206 class? Didn't think you could do anything to the carb except change needle clip.
 
From the Briggs & IKF Rulebook, 2015. Optimization of the slide opening in Briggs & Stratton Cadet, Novice, Junior 1, Junior 2 and ASN National Junior classes is permitted. The only allowable method of slide optimization is by removing material from the throttle cap. Slide opening must not exceed the appropriate ‘no go’ specification as per class regulations. For information on slide optimization see video section at www.BriggsRacing.com
 
fatchance209 said:
Thanks Brian for your response. It sounds like I need to work on handling and gear set up, I was a little loose on exit and just before corner entry I would sometimes hit the rev limiter. Had a 11/55 gear combo for a final. would going to a 12/60 or other combo make any difference or should I go a little higher on the gearing? I really like the 206 and hoping to get a class of our own, I think it would make some fun racing.
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11/55 and 12/60 are the same ratio...5.00

12/60 would be 5.00 (4.00 corrected for 20% tire slip) which with 34" diameter tires would net you approx. 43.2 MPH @6100 RPM

12/59 would be 4.92 (3.94 corrected for 20% tire slip) which with 34" diameter tires would net you approx. 43.9 MPH @6100 RPM

12/58 would be 4.84 (3.88 corrected for 20% tire slip) which with 34" diameter tires would net you approx. 44.5 MPH @6100 RPM

While these numbers aren't exact (just like a dyno) they are good for comparison.
 
fatchance209 said:
Thanks Brian for your response. It sounds like I need to work on handling and gear set up, I was a little loose on exit and just before corner entry I would sometimes hit the rev limiter. Had a 11/55 gear combo for a final. would going to a 12/60 or other combo make any difference or should I go a little higher on the gearing? I really like the 206 and hoping to get a class of our own, I think it would make some fun racing.
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If ur on 11/55. Which is same as 12/60 and hitting limiter I would go 1363or 1364. I have found that out small track I'm faster if I stay about 100-200 rpm off the chip. It's almost the ratio ur running but I have always been told stay between a 60 and 65 rear.
 
Depends if you are talking about a $200 clone or a $1200 clone. I've dynoed clones at 7.4 HP and at 8.9 HP. Compare to 206 all at 8.2-8.3 HP. That's what's so great, they are all the same whether brand new or 5 years old.
 
cdbrock said:
Depends if you are talking about a $200 clone or a $1200 clone. I've dynoed clones at 7.4 HP and at 8.9 HP. Compare to 206 all at 8.2-8.3 HP. That's what's so great, they are all the same whether brand new or 5 years old.
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Nah, say it ain't so, cd. (sarcasm intended) There's guys on here that swear their home built clones will "run with the best of them $1200 engines." Man, I've been run out of town for suggesting what you (and others) have seen on the dyno. :)

Dodge,
the numbers that Dan (gonzari) posted are pretty much spot on. Advice earlier in the thread on keeping the long slide engines off of the rev limiter is also sound advice (oval & road course.)




-----
Thanks and God bless,
Brian Carlson
Carlson Racing Engines
Vector Cutz
www.CarlsonMotorsports.com
26 years of service to the karting industry
765-339-4407
bcarlson@CarlsonMotorsports.com
 
Flash-o-matic said:
Nonsense, I'm disappointed with you Bob !
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I'm sure you are. :) And as sad as that makes me, I can't help but notice the constant mention of cheap clones, when (IMO) the Intek is also a cheap motor.
True that the two motors took different paths to get to the race track, but there's no doubt in my mind which path put more butts in kart seats.
 
Gonzari said:
Purple Slide .342 Opening from Briggs Motorsports

RPM Tor# HP
2011 6.93 2.65
2500 7.25 3.45
3000 6.84 3.91
3500 5.99 3.99
4000 5.09 3.87
4500 4.20 3.60
5000 3.50 3.33
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Not using a correction factor, (which this set of numbers shows) when comparing this dyno curve with another, makes the comparison pretty much useless.

Assuming that the barometric conditions for this run were 29.920 barometric pressure (BP) and 60 degrees Fahrenheit, (DF) which would give a correction factor of 1.0, and the conditions change to BP 29.25 with a temp of 80 degrees, this is what the numbers would look like.
RPM Torque HorsePower
2011 6.93 2.79
2500 7.25 3.63
3000 6.84 4.10
3500 5.99 4.19
4000 5.09 4.07
4500 4.20 3.78
5000 3.50 3.50

What surprises me is how much lower the clutch should be set for this class engine. Peak torque is at 2500 RPM.
 
Gonzari said:
Al- might be time to move away from the computer, make a trip to the track for some fresh air.
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I know, I sometimes get into this stuff and come up with stuff that's maybe a little too technical for you. Anybody that shows dyno data without correction factors is doing you no service at all. I was just trying to point that out. I hope it wasn't too controversial.
 
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