Track Tac

Quarter midgets versus LTO

alvin l nunley

alvin l nunley

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Strange.............the difference between the 2. They race, essentially, on pretty much the same design tracks, but they are so different in construction. Putting aside that one is suspended and the other is not, why is there so much difference in offset? They're both LTO!
 
I am far out of touch with quarter midgets .
I may remember them running continental engines or something odd .
 
They appears similar in offset, at least in the front on or rear on photos I could find.

To me it seems like both have about "as much offset as you can realistically get", is that correct?

PM



QM.jpg




LTO kart.jpg
 
As the above picture shows, quarter midgets have suspension. The offset and chassis designs have followed midget car developments. Im not sure when 1/4 midget racing began but it was a long time before kart racing took off. I believe USAC sanctioned them (and maybe still do) perhaps to get kids interested in open wheel racing
 
Mike is correct about Deco engines for awhile. I think Hondas gx120 and gx160 more currently. ...
Briggs animals in some areas .. probably LO206 would be my guess

I also think the run on small pavement tracks more than karts do.

In our area, there are no qtr midgets that I know of... but age 12 and up can run a bigger micro sprint.. 600 or 660cc dependant on class... fully suspended machines...
 
I did a bit of reading on it, and it *does* appears that quarter midgets started maybe as far back as WW2. The tracks seem to typically be 1/20th mile, which I believe was initially done because full midgets were running on a track 4 times that size (1/5th mile).

Definitely some Interesting history behind them.

PM
 
My dad raced 3/4's and falls in the 50s..
Real high end karts in the 60s, was building another full at the time of his death in 68.

Midget racing seems to be coming back to a degree here... (big midgets) but micros are real popular now.. we have a 600 micro... we sold our 500cc kart to do it
 
I raced quarter midgets in 1959 and 60 in a locally formed Racing Association. Most had no suspension a few had springs but no shocks They ran Kohler K 91 engines with a 6 to 1 gear reduction built in. No offset chassis.Go-karting had started most ran 4 cycle Clinton engines or 2 cycle Homelite engines
 
Pete, your first picture (drawing) is a front view and shows the right front tire offset 2 inches (approximate) the 2nd picture (photograph) shows a rearview, actual offset about the same. Nothing like an LTO kart.

About 1973, I was partnered with a guy named Cecil Reynolds, who was big in quarter midgets in California. Continental was the choice engine of most everybody that I saw. I understand it was a war surplus engine and was getting real hard to acquire. I remember seeing my first quarter midgets race about 1947 or 48.
 
alvin l nunley said:
Pete, your first picture (drawing) is a front view and shows the right front tire offset 2 inches (approximate) the 2nd picture (photograph) shows a rearview, actual offset about the same. Nothing like an LTO kart.

About 1973, I was partnered with a guy named Cecil Reynolds, who was big in quarter midgets in California. Continental was the choice engine of most everybody that I saw. I understand it was a war surplus engine and was getting real hard to acquire. I remember seeing my first quarter midgets race about 1947 or 48.
Click to expand...
Angles in photographs can be deceiving
 
XXX#40 said:
Angles in photographs can be deceiving
Click to expand...
I am totally aware of that. In one quarter midgets website, there are a series of maybe 10 or 12 pictures. They are sequenced as the car turns 360°. 2 pictures, one head on, the other from the tail you, definitely show the offset I'm talking about. I know what I saw!! Don't try to talk me out of it!!

I'll tell you, I sometimes wonder how stupid Some People think I am.
 
alvin l nunley said:
I am totally aware of that. In one quarter midgets website, there are a series of maybe 10 or 12 pictures. They are sequenced as the car turns 360°. 2 pictures, one head on, the other from the tail you, definitely show the offset I'm talking about. I know what I saw!! Don't try to talk me out of it!!

I'll tell you, I sometimes wonder how stupid Some People think I am.
Click to expand...
I found this.. its pretty clear
 

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Back to the original question, and I'm not an expert. Heck, im barely even a spurt...
But I think they are different from one another based on application...
As was stated. Qtr's commonly race on tiny tiny tracks.
With an LTO, the chassis, and setup, has to be geared towards corner speed, straight line speed, and entry/exit/rotate..
Witha qtr, its all corner speed, no concession needs to be made to make it shoot down a straightaway, just all corners and momentum.. gotta offset al lot, I'd think, to keep wheels on the ground ... I'd bet there's al fair amount of axle lead in a successful qtr chassis, im surprised the stagger isn't more pronounced
Im sure the differences don't end at amount of offset, ill bet wheelbase, track width, as I mentioned, axle lead all all in the equation ...
And shocks... oh my, shocks, we aren't a real serious team and I have over 20 dif torsion bars, and a dozen shocks.. a qtr midget guy would likely have more

Thats all just my guess, I know nothing about qtr midgets
 
Fourm follows function as well . Chassis design based on needs and rules .
They may have an open rear end .
My limited knowledge is antiquated , mid 60's .
Shocks and full frame vs two by four's with wheels ; ala push kart .
 
Good point on open rear end.
We once tried a freewheel hub on an outlaw kart, and indeed, I bought the hub from a qtr midget supplier ..
Very good point
 
josheezpapa said:
Back to the original question, and I'm not an expert. Heck, im barely even a spurt...
But I think they are different from one another based on application...
Click to expand...
I was involved very closely with a quarter midgets builder and tuner for about a year and a half around 1974. I attended quite a few races at the Sunnyvale California track.

My recollections leave me with quite a big difference in views compare to yours.

For instance "tiny tiny" doesn't fit my recollections. In the early 80s, I was the flag man at the Fremont California dirt kart track. There were definitely differences between the tracks and the vehicles they raced on the tracks, but it wasn't like apples and oranges differences.
 
We ran across some "speedway midgets" one time that ran on a 1/8 i think... there were several classes .... we were the only outlaw kart, but they were about the same size...
When we were asked who we'd like to mix it up with... I looked at the two guys who's wing center sections were pretty much covered with feature winner and national champion stickers..
We ran a 134cc cr125 at the time.. one of them was a stroker cr250 and the other was two 100something cc 2 strokes.
We had a ball mixing it up with them. One heat we actually finished ahead of one.

We had ran across some others w yamahas.. those guys weren't as friendly. Lol..

Moral of the story.. there are some "Speedway Midgets" that make their homes on bigger tracks also
 
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