A GO TO thread for the new or newer dirt oval racers offering Info & Support

[racing promotor]

Thanks so much for the help!! It's a 1/5 mile track as they demoed the old small layout and expanded this year so they could run micros.
I know it's a tall order asking setup over the intranets lol but appreciate what help can be sent. I'll get to working on the kart this weekend

If indeed the new layout is a fifth mile you'll have to much rear stagger as your current numbers suggest, most tracks over estimate the size so even if a small fifth 1 1/8" rear stagger will be max you'll need.

 

[MAS]

At what tread depth would you deem a Burris 33 no longer useable at?

 

[racing promotor]

At what tread depth would you deem a Burris 33 no longer useable at?

That would all depend on your definition of useable, I assume you mean useable but still close to optimal performance for your application, that I would say depth still needs to be within 80 % of whats required, after that tires for a thicker application are still useable well past the 80 % point for a different application where track grips up better, on a real good track with lot's of grip I've seen one good run after the cords are starting to show through at places in the tire. Remember lower the grip softer applications require thicker rubber in general, the higher the grip harder applications the thinner the rubber in general, then you get into all the different profiles as well.

 

[CarlsonMotorsports]

At what tread depth would you deem a Burris 33 no longer useable at?

At one particular big money race several years ago, old 33s cut right to the cords was the way to go as nearly everyone at that race was bringing me tires to take right down to nothing on the tire lathe I brought to the track with us.

We still have several sets of thin flat cuts for just such occasions. Newer isn't always better with 33s, that's for sure.
It all depends on what the track surface calls for.


-----
Thanks and God bless,
Brian Carlson
Carlson Racing Engines
Vector Cutz
www.CarlsonMotorsports.com
Carlson Motorsports on Facebook
31 years of service to the karting industry
Linden, IN
765-339-4407
bcarlson@CarlsonMotorsports.com

 

[MAS]

That would all depend on your definition of useable, I assume you mean useable but still close to optimal performance for your application, that I would say depth still needs to be within 80 % of whats required, after that tires for a thicker application are still useable well past the 80 % point for a different application where track grips up better, on a real good track with lot's of grip I've seen one good run after the cords are starting to show through at places in the tire. Remember lower the grip softer applications require thicker rubber in general, the higher the grip harder applications the thinner the rubber in general, then you get into all the different profiles as well.

The track we run at was just redone the middle of last year with new clay. It’s very tacky most nights but I have seen the occasional night where it turns dry slick when we don’t get any rain

 

[racing promotor]

The track we run at was just redone the middle of last year with new clay. It’s very tacky most nights but I have seen the occasional night where it turns dry slick when we don’t get any rain

Have you or anyone you know confirmed what's best for normal conditions, meaning full rubber sand them and race them, cut just enough to true them up some, Very tacky around here would be round cut and still be considered thicker.

 

[MAS]

Have you or anyone you know confirmed what's best for normal conditions, meaning full rubber sand them and race them, cut just enough to true them up some, Very tacky around here would be round cut and still be considered thicker.

I just started running karts last July. Everyone stands their tires. Very few guys run cut tires. The tire game isn’t very strong as far as I’m concerned. As a newbie nobody seems to be able to tell me what they’re looking for in terms of duro on a regular night. Most guys don’t even own a durometer up here. I’ve taken a real interest in the sport and am really working hard to do my homework and ask a lot of questions to try to get up front. I’m a big guy to begin with so if I can get the tire deal figured out where everyone else is out to lunch that’ll help put me in contention I hope

 

[CarlsonMotorsports]

I've not seen a time where cut tires aren't as fast or faster than uncut tires. The advantage diminishes with the amount of available grip in the track surface AND with track size.
When a track bites up good, and bigger momentum tracks, is when cut tires really show their advantage.
I suspect that most are running 33's as they come (around 50-52d) and adding bite either during the week without softening, or just adding a harsh PRW at the track (a common practice by some on Burris.)

You can accomplish bite either way, but be prepared to swap out tires often if you're using the harsh PRW method each time the car hits the track.
You are correct in assuming that if you figure out a tire program before your competition, that'll help make you competitive.

If there's anything we can do to help, please feel free to contact us at the shop number listed in my signature.
We have a great Burris 33 program (Vector Cutz & Preps) to offer, and we've raced all across the country.


-----
Thanks and God bless,
Brian Carlson
Carlson Racing Engines
Vector Cutz
www.CarlsonMotorsports.com
Carlson Motorsports on Facebook
31 years of service to the karting industry
Linden, IN
765-339-4407
bcarlson@CarlsonMotorsports.com

 

[MAS]

I've not seen a time where cut tires aren't as fast or faster than uncut tires. The advantage diminishes with the amount of available grip in the track surface AND with track size.
When a track bites up good, and bigger momentum tracks, is when cut tires really show their advantage.
I suspect that most are running 33's as they come (around 50-52d) and adding bite either during the week without softening, or just adding a harsh PRW at the track (a common practice by some on Burris.)

You can accomplish bite either way, but be prepared to swap out tires often if you're using the harsh PRW method each time the car hits the track.
You are correct in assuming that if you figure out a tire program before your competition, that'll help make you competitive.

If there's anything we can do to help, please feel free to contact us at the shop number listed in my signature.
We have a great Burris 33 program (Vector Cutz & Preps) to offer, and we've raced all across the country.


-----
Thanks and God bless,
Brian Carlson
Carlson Racing Engines
Vector Cutz
www.CarlsonMotorsports.com
Carlson Motorsports on Facebook
31 years of service to the karting industry
Linden, IN
765-339-4407
bcarlson@CarlsonMotorsports.com

Does a harsh prep include anything with goat in it? Is goat the only way that softener is added to preps or are there other methods that are less harsh that are used?

 

[alvin l nunley]

by track size in this thread that show with in a quarter inch stay accurate. which is as accurate or more accurate than using any spread sheet where guy's are guessing on the measurements.

You have a point, you can't guess on track size. We're always guessing, sometimes we guess right, sometimes we guess wrong. While my spreadsheet expects reasonably accurate measurements, they don't have to be all that precise. It appears nobody wants to go too that much trouble (measure the track) they make a guess and test. With enough testing, they will eventually find the right combination.
It amazes me the opposition something as simple as a spreadsheet can generate.

 

[alvin l nunley]

In 1982 I bought my first PC. It came with a spreadsheet, a word processor and an Accounting Package.
When I discovered what you could do with a spreadsheet I thought I had died and gone to heaven. I've been a "spreadsheet junkie" ever since. A problem, a problem, my kingdom for a problem.
My first big problem; piston travel per degree of crankshaft rotation. That is not a simple problem, at least not for someone at my skill level.
Ever since then, it has been amazingly confusing the resistance I get from people without my skills. Not that I'm all that smart, or skillful, just enthusiastic and determined.

 

[CarlsonMotorsports]

Does a harsh prep include anything with goat in it? Is goat the only way that softener is added to preps or are there other methods that are less harsh that are used?

Absolutely. Goat is not the only way to soften a tire. In fact, I believe there are much better chemicals available that will not pull all of the oils out of the rubber. Our "Monster Bite" is just one example. If you must use goat, then at least cut it with some of our "Pink Panther" so that it puts some good oils back in the tire.

 

[jaymancds]

Absolutely. Goat is not the only way to soften a tire. In fact, I believe there are much better chemicals available that will not pull all of the oils out of the rubber. Our "Monster Bite" is just one example. If you must use goat, then at least cut it with some of our "Pink Panther" so that it puts some good oils back in the tire.

A friend of mine gave me a "tip" the other day and I'm a bit confused by it. He was saying that once you've had a race or two in the season and your tires are fairly saturated with prep, you can wipe on Mystery Oil to help get oil back in the tire. He said that in between races he will wipe a couple coats of the oil instead of prep, and then when he gets to the track start back with prep. Has anybody done this? Is there any merit to it?

 

[racing promotor]

A friend of mine gave me a "tip" the other day and I'm a bit confused by it. He was saying that once you've had a race or two in the season and your tires are fairly saturated with prep, you can wipe on Mystery Oil to help get oil back in the tire. He said that in between races he will wipe a couple coats of the oil instead of prep, and then when he gets to the track start back with prep. Has anybody done this? Is there any merit to it?

I've heard of it being done with WD 40 not the oil, but I would say the right conditioner would be better suited to use.

 

[CarlsonMotorsports]

A friend of mine gave me a "tip" the other day and I'm a bit confused by it. He was saying that once you've had a race or two in the season and your tires are fairly saturated with prep, you can wipe on Mystery Oil to help get oil back in the tire. He said that in between races he will wipe a couple coats of the oil instead of prep, and then when he gets to the track start back with prep. Has anybody done this? Is there any merit to it?

Marvel Mystery Oil is a pentrating oil (or primary use anyhow,) I'm sure it would add some oil into the tire, but it would also soften considerably I am thinking. Transmission fluid, diesel fuel, WD40 -- all were old school preps back in the day. I think we've come a long ways from them in tire preps used today. Not to say that they won't work, it just wouldn't be my prep of choice.

 

[jaymancds]

Marvel Mystery Oil is a pentrating oil (or primary use anyhow,) I'm sure it would add some oil into the tire, but it would also soften considerably I am thinking. Transmission fluid, diesel fuel, WD40 -- all were old school preps back in the day. I think we've come a long ways from them in tire preps used today. Not to say that they won't work, it just wouldn't be my prep of choice.

I didn't think it made a ton of sense, but I figured I'd ask it here. Thanks

 

[racinnut15xm]

Marvel Mystery Oil is a pentrating oil (or primary use anyhow,) I'm sure it would add some oil into the tire, but it would also soften considerably I am thinking. Transmission fluid, diesel fuel, WD40 -- all were old school preps back in the day. I think we've come a long ways from them in tire preps used today. Not to say that they won't work, it just wouldn't be my prep of choice.

I've been wondering on ways to keep trailer and truck tires from dry rotting. My dually may see 3000miles a year and I put new tires on it a year ago. Often it gets mud up the sidewalls from running through muddy pits at the races, Think coating them down with wd would help? Tough to get any washer between the two tires to really get the mud/dirt off.

 

[CarlsonMotorsports]

WD will definitely help keep the mud from sticking -- we used in on the sprint car for many years.
It WILL attract dust though (dirt & brake dust.)

Baby oil is MUCH cheaper and works the same.

Using the one touch tire cleaner stuff, Westlie's etc, is really hard on tires as it pulls oils out. I've spent thousands on semi tires due to this. We always wanted the race rig looking good, but the tires all dry rotted in the sidewalls long before they wore the first 1/32 of an inch off. At that point they're not even good for re-treading.

Oh yea...I have tried Westlie's on kart tires...and it does the same thing...pulls the oils (preps) out of them over time...take that for what it's worth. LOL

 

[jaymancds]

It may be in here but I couldn't find it, I tore down my kart Saturday and just gave everything a once over since I am planning to be racing next week. I took the shoe clutch off of my predator and cleaned everything really well. After I put it all together I fired it up and I noticed the clutch moving laterally on the shaft about a 1/16th of an inch. The chain has about a little less than a half inch of play on the top side. Should the clutch be moving or do I need to get a washer to hold it tight?

 

[racing promotor]

It may be in here but I couldn't find it, I tore down my kart Saturday and just gave everything a once over since I am planning to be racing next week. I took the shoe clutch off of my predator and cleaned everything really well. After I put it all together I fired it up and I noticed the clutch moving laterally on the shaft about a 1/16th of an inch. The chain has about a little less than a half inch of play on the top side. Should the clutch be moving or do I need to get a washer to hold it tight?

A slight amount of end play on the shaft is normal, but may not be everyone's preference, to tight I would think would be worse than little play,but confirm it's just a little end play or is it basket wobble that would be different.