Early fire tire vs late firing tires

[racing promotor]

Not to mention, smaller tires/less contact patch equals less rolling resistance which we all know plate classes can benefit from. Think of a 6.0 tire on the RR and a 4.50 on the LR how much lighter the axle would be to turn! Less rotating mass plus less rolling resistance down the straights!

In my mind, it works but I'm afraid to try it!

Were back to a lot in karting don't make sense, chalk this up in that category, don't waste your time it won't work !!

 

[BrendanFitz#73]

Tires will get hot and lose grip the hotter they get. Prep isnt a band-aid it is something to make speed with. It will help a tire heat up (fire) and if you get it right wont lose as much grip throughout the entire run as compared to an unprepped tire. If it was just a band-aid then why can an unprepped tire never out run a prepped tire at a big show? Even in plate classes the smaller right sides just wont work. The wider tire will handle more abuse and disperse the heat better than a narrower tire. Some things kart related just plain dont make sense to our brains but make sense when we look at the lap times.

 

[racing promotor]

Tires will get hot and lose grip the hotter they get. Prep isnt a band-aid it is something to make speed with. It will help a tire heat up (fire) and if you get it right wont lose as much grip throughout the entire run as compared to an unprepped tire. If it was just a band-aid then why can an unprepped tire never out run a prepped tire at a big show? Even in plate classes the smaller right sides just wont work. The wider tire will handle more abuse and disperse the heat better than a narrower tire. Some things kart related just plain dont make sense to our brains but make sense when we look at the lap times.

Agree, however would point out in Burris 33 racing there are times where an unprepped tire will out run a prepped tire.

 

[BrendanFitz#73]

Agree, however would point out in Burris 33 racing there are times where an unprepped tire will out run a prepped tire.

Yeah I know Ken but most guys down south are on the maxxis and vega programs. We got it easy up in the north. Even in IN and IL burris is the dominant tire but there are some nights hoosiers and maxxis are faster.

 

[racing promotor]

While reading this post REMEMBER the title of this thread, If it does not exist yet and you were to have went to this same race trying some things mentioned like you used a narrower tire putting it into the track more, and you raised VCG on tires already over gripping, changed set up to run on the RR more, you would have posted it in the same manor as what were reading, Earl's answer as to where you went wrong would of been real simple, you ran to narrow of a tire put it into the the track to much , over worked the RR, and raising VCG was the wrong move, and his post would of got like a dozen likes, plus he would not of been alone a lot of others would have pointed it out as well, including me !!

 

[racing promotor]

Yeah I know Ken but most guys down south are on the maxxis and vega programs. We got it easy up in the north. Even in IN and IL burris is the dominant tire but there are some nights hoosiers and maxxis are faster.

I understand and knew where You were coming from, only pointed it out so one of the newer guy's reading didn't think it was always 100 %.

 

[jaymancds]

Were back to a lot in karting don't make sense, chalk this up in that category, don't waste your time it won't work !!

It won't work, or you haven't found a way to make it work? asking for a friend.

 

[racing promotor]

It won't work, or you haven't found a way to make it work? asking for a friend.

Tell your friend it's not been that long ago we ran on narrower wheels, with no prep, and on the RR more, we got where were at for a reason it's been proven faster

 

[jaymancds]

Tell your friend it's not been that long ago we ran on narrower wheels, with no prep, and on the RR more, we got where were at for a reason it's been proven faster

So this begs the question, a few weeks back we were all going back and forth about how much of the right side tires were on the surface while at speed. The obvious answer was not much. Therefore, if someone could find a way to manage the heat through proper tire prepping, the benefit of the rolling resistance could theoretically make that the faster option. Is my friend thinking correctly, assuming all of these things are possible?

 

[racing promotor]

So this begs the question, a few weeks back we were all going back and forth about how much of the right side tires were on the surface while at speed. The obvious answer was not much. Therefore, if someone could find a way to manage the heat through proper tire prepping, the benefit of the rolling resistance could theoretically make that the faster option. Is my friend thinking correctly, assuming all of these things are possible?

Someone does always manage heat best through prepping, he would be the " WINNER ", just it's on wider wheels, If anyone could always make theoretically work out 100 % there would never be a different winner !!

 

[flattop1]

Not to mention, smaller tires/less contact patch equals less rolling resistance which we all know plate classes can benefit from. Think of a 6.0 tire on the RR and a 4.50 on the LR how much lighter the axle would be to turn! Less rotating mass plus less rolling resistance down the straights!

In my mind, it works but I'm afraid to try it!

Someone has to be the first too try something new .
Seasons over now is a good time , give it a shot at a local events .

 

[racing promotor]

Someone has to be the first too try something new .
Seasons over now is a good time , give it a shot at a local events .

And if you do that and it works out, just realize your not going to go to next years world 100 and get the same results

 

[jaymancds]

Someone does always manage heat best through prepping, he would be the " WINNER ", just it's on wider wheels, If anyone could always make theoretically work out 100 % there would never be a different winner !!

Im just thinking about how often we discuss lowering resistance in predator classes, I might just try it. Maybe.

 

[flattop1]

^^^^^^ jaymancds your situation is perfect . no prep treads .
Funny thing we ran treads back in 03 all the time . Fellow shows up with
4 -12/6/9 K21's. on a jr1 kart . Honestly they didn't do bad . Surprised me .

 

[Termite52]

you talk about lowering resistance are you allowed to lower the weight of the cart and make chassis adjustments .have you tried a 4.0 tire on the left front and a 5.0 tire on the right side. .

 

[Ted Hamilton]

In my mind, it works but I'm afraid to try it!

Which is why you try it in testing or hot laps...

 

[BrendanFitz#73]

Ive seen guys try narrower tires on the right side. It was funny watching them come out of the corner. When you leave the corner having that nice wide tire helps disperse the load better as all the weight is transferring back to the corner. Same principle with entering the turn. The rf takes majority of the hit on entry. Smaller tires didnt pan out too well. Havent seen anyone try it in a long time.

We are where we are with chassis dynamics and the way tires are for a reason. It works.

 

[OVALTECH1]

Not to mention, smaller tires/less contact patch equals less rolling resistance which we all know plate classes can benefit from. Think of a 6.0 tire on the RR and a 4.50 on the LR how much lighter the axle would be to turn! Less rotating mass plus less rolling resistance down the straights!

In my mind, it works but I'm afraid to try it!

Works great in the low horse predator class to keep momentum to an optimum.

 

[SoCo Tire Treatments]

Im just going to throw this out there as informational purposes only.
Those of us who been around a long time remember the days of narrow wheels and smaller tires and in those times it worked. UNTIL someone made a wider wheel and tire, which created more speed, and the wider the wheel got the faster we went. Rules on tire width and wheel width then needed to be applied.
Its been tried, its been tested.

 

[CarlsonMotorsports]

^ Agree with Earl - with the exception of treaded tires in low HP classes.
We've proven it over the past few years now that you don't need all that tread width...it's just killing roll speed on Predators, L206s, even BP'd clones and animals. Now, we do still use ridiculously wide wheels, and there's separate reasons for that.
With treads, we've gone to smaller tires all around, and cut half the tread (or more) off of them and are TONS faster.
It's been enough of an advantage that now some tracks and sanctioning bodies have put minimum tread depth rules on their tires, and dictated their specific (larger) sizes of tires be run.